Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

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MacynSnow
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Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

Post by MacynSnow »

Honestly, i don't think he is. Say what you will about Writers & Status Quo junk, but Assume with me for a moment, That the DC Universe was a Real reality(the Reality River idea) and Batman was operating in a place like Gotham(basically that realities Chicago). From appearances alone, it look's like no difference is being made atall...
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Batgirl III
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

Post by Batgirl III »

Sir Robert Peel, Bt FRS, is generally regarded as the father of modern policing, owing to his founding of the Metropolitan Police Service (a.k.a., "the Bobbies"). One of the key Peelian Principles is that the goal of law enforcement is "[t]o prevent crime and disorder, as an alternative to their repression by military force and severity of legal punishment." Also, an officer of the law must "[r]ecognize always that the test of police efficiency is the absence of crime and disorder, and not the visible evidence of police action in dealing with them."

Now, depending on exactly what you consider to be part of continuity or not, let's just look at some of the things that the Batman has done for Gotham City: broken the strangle hold of organized crime on city government and city policing (Batman: Year One), prevented a weaponized strain of ebola from being used against other cities and cured the people of Gotham (Batman: Contagion), maintained some semblance of law and order after the city of abandoned by the United States (No Man's Land), saved the entire Earth (any given JLA story arc) and/or the entire universe (Infinite Crisis) and brought to justice uncounted numbers of burglars, rapists, murderers, and terrorists (any given issue of any of his comics).

Gotham City is not entirely absent of crime, but think of how much worse it would be without him.
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MacynSnow
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

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Counterpoint: Let's look at the type of Criminals that replaced the one's Batman has stopped and now make Gotham their regular Home(let's ignore guy's like Lex and any actual Alien's and circle on those who Debuted in Gotham City proper) shall we?
The Joker-has killed more people than any Mob hit in history(he almost reached the number of Dead from our War in Korea during Joker War) and has stated he's only in Gotham because Batman's there....
Solomon Grundy(Slaughter Swamp was originally part of Gotham County proper)-Depending on what day of the week our resident Failed Elemental rises on, he's either comitted over half a million dollars in either Larceny or Damages to the city's infrastructure....
Scarecrow-his Fear gas has caused over 200 cases of heart attacks alone, not to mention all the Property damage from mass Hysteria...
Poison Ivy?(don't remember if she's a local or not)-mostly her's is Property damage, but she has killed at least 20 people...

Everyone of these, with the exception of Joker and Grundy, could've been helped Psychologically after first time capture IF Batman had let the FBI handle 'em like they told the GCPD. Commissioner Gordon(a long-time friend of the Wayne's), ON THE RECOMMENDATION OF BATMAN, refused their help. Look where it's got Gotham now...

Your serve. :)
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Batgirl III
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

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Why does everyone blame the Batman for this though? No one ever gets this upset with Gotham's other resident heroes like Green Lantern (Alan Scott) and he's been an active hero in the city since before Bruce Wayne was born. But I digress...

The Batman doesn't decide what sentences the criminals he apprehends are given, that's the responsibility of the state, federal, and municipal courts. Felons convicted by the state are incarcerated in Blackgate Penitentiary or Gotham State Penitentiary, felons convicted for federal crimes are turned over to the standard federal prison system, unless they are metahumans in which case they're sent to Belle Reve. Persons found not criminally responsible by reason of mental disorder but adjudicated as presenting a risk of harm to themselves or others are sent to Arkham Asylum for treatment... It's hardly the Batman's fault that these prisons seem to have revolving doors. I mean, over in Metropolis, Superman keeps sending guys to Stryker's Island Penitentiary and out west the Flash keeps sending his rogues to Ironheights and they break out with the same frequency.

If your issue is with the penal system, take it up with your state legislature and write your congressman.
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MacynSnow
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

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I don't actually blame Bats for these guy's at all, with the exception of Joker but that depends on Origin. All i'm saying is that he allowed the Situation to get Dangerous to all civilians in Gotham. Yes, the crime in Gotham was bad(especially since Scott retired), but you didn't have guy's like Scarecrow, Ivy or Joker going on Killing sprees. All you had that did that was Grundy, who hadn't been seen since GL One retired. He could've done SO much better as Bruce Wayne to help the City itself, but unfortunately he gave into his PTSD and Trauma. Yes, he's one of the greatest Heroes in the World and have saved countless number of people, but look at who pay's the price for it...
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Ken
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

Post by Ken »

MacynSnow wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 12:45 amYes, the crime in Gotham was bad(especially since Scott retired), but you didn't have guy's like Scarecrow, Ivy or Joker going on Killing sprees.
And because Batman was there first it's his fault they're there?

If Batman wasn't there, how do we know the villains wouldn't still be there? Well, no Batman, Harvey Dent would have died. And Ra's wouldn't have a massive woody to have Batman nail his daughter. Nora Schimmel still world have been terminally Ill, and Victor Schimmel would still have likely had his accident. Nigma would still have his riddle fetish. And Professor McElroy would still be hallucinating about being the boy king. And if they do come to Gotham to challenge Batman, would Penguin be less deadly operating out of Civic City, or Gateway City, MO, or Midway City, or Gateway City, OR, or Star City?
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

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And let’s not forget that directly across Delaware Bay stands the city of tomorrow: Metropolis. Maybe if Superman had never come to town, some of Gotham’s super-criminals would feel safer operating in that city... Thereby reducing the strain on the GCPD?
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

Post by MacynSnow »

Ken wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 6:18 am
MacynSnow wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 12:45 amYes, the crime in Gotham was bad(especially since Scott retired), but you didn't have guy's like Scarecrow, Ivy or Joker going on Killing sprees.
And because Batman was there first it's his fault they're there?

If Batman wasn't there, how do we know the villains wouldn't still be there? Well, no Batman, Harvey Dent would have died. And Ra's wouldn't have a massive woody to have Batman nail his daughter. Nora Schimmel still world have been terminally Ill, and Victor Schimmel would still have likely had his accident. Nigma would still have his riddle fetish. And Professor McElroy would still be hallucinating about being the boy king. And if they do come to Gotham to challenge Batman, would Penguin be less deadly operating out of Civic City, or Gateway City, MO, or Midway City, or Gateway City, OR, or Star City?
Never said any of it was his Fault(Except maybe Joker, but that' depending on origin),
i'm just saying he coulda put that wad of Cash of his to Much better use than buying bulk Bat ears. If he'd poured the Money he's spent as Batman into making the City better(Like his Parents were planning on), we might not've seen all the Criminally Insane Villian's that showed up.Let's take a look see...
--Victor & Nora would've had the Medical help they needed .They'd still be stuck as Mr.&Ms.Freeze, but at least she'd be alive.
--Harvey Dent's death, while tragic, would've set the GCPD after every Vrook and Gangster in town. The Corrupt one's wouldn'tve been able to hide behind the Badge.
--while still having that weird riddle thing, Eddie would have been able to Successfully sued and gained Creative Control of his Game.
--The good Professor would've had proper help with the Exhibit in the first place(Martha Wayne was the Primary Donator for the Gotham Museum).
Your right, guy's like Penguin and Ra's are still Dangerous in other Cities. But were talking Gotham City here, the other places have other Heroes to Protect them.
as a brief aside: Victor Buono is one of my favorite Villian Actors of all time next to Vincent Price and Christopher Lee. You may know him as "Tutty"...
Image
But I know him as the Good "Count Manzeppi"....
Image
Last edited by MacynSnow on Sat Feb 20, 2021 8:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

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i'm just saying he coulda put that wad of Cash of his to Much better use than buying bulk Bat ears. If he'd poured the Money he's spent as Batman into making the City better(Like his Parents were planning on), we might not've seen all the Criminally Insane Villian's that showed up.
Bruce Wayne has poured vast sums into Gotham City in the form of charity, taxes, and direct investment. Comics being comics, they never really give an exact dollar amount and some writers remember it better than others, but Wayne is almost always described as a "billionaire philanthropist" or "billionaire industrialist." Darn near every other story arc opens with Wayne attending a black tie charity function or a ribbon cutting on some new hospital.
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

Post by MacynSnow »

Batgirl III wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 7:39 am
i'm just saying he coulda put that wad of Cash of his to Much better use than buying bulk Bat ears. If he'd poured the Money he's spent as Batman into making the City better(Like his Parents were planning on), we might not've seen all the Criminally Insane Villian's that showed up.
Bruce Wayne has poured vast sums into Gotham City in the form of charity, taxes, and direct investment. Comics being comics, they never really give an exact dollar amount and some writers remember it better than others, but Wayne is almost always described as a "billionaire philanthropist" or "billionaire industrialist." Darn near every other story arc opens with Wayne attending a black tie charity function or a ribbon cutting on some new hospital.
Too true, i stand verbally Reposited!
It unfortunately feel's like it's not going anywhere though. It almost look's like he's funneling the Money he "gift's " to the charities gack to himself, as the Wayn Foundation has controlking intrest in almost all those Charities.
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

Post by Batgirl III »

All of the expenditures are no doubt disclosed publicly and properly reported to the IRS, SEC, FTC, or whatever other alphabet soup regulatory agencies exist in the DC Universe.
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

Post by Ken »

MacynSnow wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 6:51 am And Professor McElroy would still be hallucinating about being the boy king.
--The good Professor would've had proper help with the Exhibit in the first place(Martha Wayne was the Primary Donator for the Gotham Museum).
Your right, guy's like Penguin and Ra's are still Dangerous in other Cities. But were talking Gotham City here, the other places have other Heroes to Protect them.
as a brief aside: Victor Buono is one of my favorite Villian Actors of all time next to Vincent Price and Christopher Lee. You may know him as "Tutty"...
Image
But I know him as the Good "Count Manzeppi"....
Image
[/quote]

I don't know which exhibit you mean. But Dr. McElroy's dementia resulted from getting hit on the head during a student protest.
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

Post by MacynSnow »

Ken wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 11:46 am
MacynSnow wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 6:51 am And Professor McElroy would still be hallucinating about being the boy king.
--The good Professor would've had proper help with the Exhibit in the first place(Martha Wayne was the Primary Donator for the Gotham Museum).
Your right, guy's like Penguin and Ra's are still Dangerous in other Cities. But were talking Gotham City here, the other places have other Heroes to Protect them.
as a brief aside: Victor Buono is one of my favorite Villian Actors of all time next to Vincent Price and Christopher Lee. You may know him as "Tutty"...
Image
But I know him as the Good "Count Manzeppi"....
Image
I don't know which exhibit you mean. But Dr. McElroy's dementia resulted from getting hit on the head during a student protest.
[/quote]
Ah, musta missed his origin episode. I know the one i caught, he got beaned by an Exhibit piece.
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

Post by Shock »

MacynSnow wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 7:47 am
Batgirl III wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 7:39 am
i'm just saying he coulda put that wad of Cash of his to Much better use than buying bulk Bat ears. If he'd poured the Money he's spent as Batman into making the City better(Like his Parents were planning on), we might not've seen all the Criminally Insane Villian's that showed up.
Bruce Wayne has poured vast sums into Gotham City in the form of charity, taxes, and direct investment. Comics being comics, they never really give an exact dollar amount and some writers remember it better than others, but Wayne is almost always described as a "billionaire philanthropist" or "billionaire industrialist." Darn near every other story arc opens with Wayne attending a black tie charity function or a ribbon cutting on some new hospital.
Too true, i stand verbally Reposited!
It unfortunately feel's like it's not going anywhere though. It almost look's like he's funneling the Money he "gift's " to the charities gack to himself, as the Wayn Foundation has controlking intrest in almost all those Charities.
If he actually got results, they'd have to stop writing the comics.
MacynSnow
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Re: Is Batman actually Doing Anything to Help Gotham?

Post by MacynSnow »

Shock wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 10:24 pm
MacynSnow wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 7:47 am
Batgirl III wrote: Sat Feb 20, 2021 7:39 am

Bruce Wayne has poured vast sums into Gotham City in the form of charity, taxes, and direct investment. Comics being comics, they never really give an exact dollar amount and some writers remember it better than others, but Wayne is almost always described as a "billionaire philanthropist" or "billionaire industrialist." Darn near every other story arc opens with Wayne attending a black tie charity function or a ribbon cutting on some new hospital.
Too true, i stand verbally Reposited!
It unfortunately feel's like it's not going anywhere though. It almost look's like he's funneling the Money he "gift's " to the charities gack to himself, as the Wayn Foundation has controlking intrest in almost all those Charities.
If he actually got results, they'd have to stop writing the comics.
Again, your not wrong. The idea behind this is the whole "Infinite Realms, Infinite Possibilities" argument. In a Reality where all that suff in DC is happening, is Batman actually helping Gotham in the long run?
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