Vehicle Weapons don't make sense

A place to discuss game rules, homebrew systems and the like.
Post Reply
Whiplash123
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2023 10:17 pm

Vehicle Weapons don't make sense

Post by Whiplash123 »

I need help with how to interpret vehicle weapons in the Heroes Handbook. Example: Battleship. Massive gun batteries. Ranged Damage 13, Burst Area 9. This makes no sense to me. This means the guns have a short range 325 ft, medium of 650 feet, and long of 1300 feet. So the battleship can't fire beyond about a quarter of a mile. Also, the Burst 9 means that the shot has a Burst radius of 1 miles. So it would hit itself every time it fired.

Also, this attack costs 11 points PER RANK, 1 for Damage, 1 for Ranged, 8 for Burst ranks. , That's 143 points.

Were they being especially sloppy when they wrote this? You guys must add stuff like extended range to make this make sense. Indirect maybe.

Another question in the same vein. How should I write up an old sailing ship's weapons where a very large warship had 60-100 cannons on it?

Regards,
W.
User avatar
TheStray7
Posts: 195
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2023 12:27 pm
Location: Here, there and everywhere

Re: Vehicle Weapons don't make sense

Post by TheStray7 »

This isn't built with multiple instances of the Burst Area mod, it's built with a partial Burst Area mod -- whatever you make your attack roll against suffers 13 damage directly, while everything in a regular 30-ft area Burst takes Damage 9 instead.
When the cat's a Stray, the mice will pray...
User avatar
Davies
Posts: 5034
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 10:37 pm
Location: Edmonton, AB

Re: Vehicle Weapons don't make sense

Post by Davies »

TheStray7 wrote: Tue Nov 07, 2023 4:53 pm This isn't built with multiple instances of the Burst Area mod, it's built with a partial Burst Area mod -- whatever you make your attack roll against suffers 13 damage directly, while everything in a regular 30-ft area Burst takes Damage 9 instead.
This.

As to your other question, you should probably just build that as a large Ranged Damage (9 or 10) effect, since it's normal for all the cannons to fire at once; firing just one of them can be represented by using a lower Damage rank.
"I'm sorry. I love you. I'm not sorry I love you."
Whiplash123
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2023 10:17 pm

Re: Vehicle Weapons don't make sense

Post by Whiplash123 »

Aha. Duh. I guess I... my eyes were parsing this in the wrong way. Now it makes so much more sense. Thanks.

To Davies: This makes perfect sense in the case of ship cannons that are all pointed in the same direction. But what if you were building a starship with a bunch of "phasers" that could point in many directions and engage many targets at once.

Multiattack might work in some cases, but in other cases, would it be best to use a large Burst area and then put Selective on it so you could target only what you wanted? That would be pretty expensive.

Maybe Split would also work.
Shock
Posts: 2967
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:27 pm
Location: Connecticut USA

Re: Vehicle Weapons don't make sense

Post by Shock »

M&M doesn't have much (if any) guidance on how to handle vehicles with multiple crew stations. You kinda just have to common sense/muddle through it.To build something with multiple weapons that each requires a different character to operate, I'd suggest full price for the first weapon and then a single point for each additional weapon of the same type.

If you want a single character to be able to target a bunch of different targets, you're getting into things the action economy of M&M isn't going to handle well
User avatar
catsi563
Posts: 4105
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 10:29 pm
Location: Dark Side of the Moon
Contact:

Re: Vehicle Weapons don't make sense

Post by catsi563 »

Also to add in the range increment is not the END of the range where the weapon is effective ie the shells dont just drop off and stop instead its at the end of where the weapon is considered accurate and thus the shooter aquires penalties for long or extreme long range

Some weapons like the battleships guns or Ballistic missiles may show this with extended range advantages
Dr. Silverback has wryly observed that this is like trying to teach lolcats about Shakespeare

Showdown at the Litterbox

Catsi stories
greycrusader
Posts: 1177
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 11:25 pm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Re: Vehicle Weapons don't make sense

Post by greycrusader »

Honestly? M&M isn't really designed to handle the sort of combat discussed above; as I commented on a question about conducting aerial dogfights that came up on the FB page, a GM may be better off taking guidance from other d20 based table-top games, or simply representing such battles as a series of skill challenges/DC checks, as the combat rules get rather wonky and break down pretty quickly if going strictly RAW. Just my humble take on the matter.

All my best.
Harnos
Posts: 478
Joined: Fri Mar 27, 2020 2:03 am

Re: Vehicle Weapons don't make sense

Post by Harnos »

At least that can be said for tank cannons. They do 10 damage, same as a rocket launcher. I am not a military expert but I think tank cannons can do more damage than a shoulder mounted weapon, by the value of sheer size if nothing else. Also weapons of spaceships and other space vehicles don't do much more damage than 21st century vehicles.
Post Reply