Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

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Spectrum
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Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by Spectrum » Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:40 pm

Onyx Path, the most social justice oriented gaming company that I still support... has a weekly advertising update.

This week started with something that confuses me:

"Long time readers of this blog might have noticed that we, or the tabletop RPG business as a whole, often have incidents occur during the course of a year that flare up on social media for one reason or the other that Onyx Path doesn’t really officially comment on. This isn’t an accident, as I don’t think a lot is gained by verbally sparring in social media while we have games and books that need to be created and made available to all of you folks.

This can be frustrating. I mean really, really, head is going to explode, frustrating. Particularly when ourselves or our friends are being attacked online.

But here is a statement I _do_ need to make officially, although I never thought it would have been necessary. It, in fact, squicks me out to think that the world needs to hear this, but since a whole bunch of folks have indicated that they’d feel a lot better if I said it, there you go:

Onyx Path is against Nazis. We do not support Nazis, and if you are reading this and self-identify as a Nazi, we don’t make these games for you. Don’t buy them, or steal them, or read them, or play them.

Simplistic and low-hanging fruit, maybe, but this is something I thought was painfully obvious about us. Yet, clearly it was not. Hence this statement, made in all seriousness to hopefully end any confusion, and starting us out today so that you, our loyal readers, know where we stand first."

Err... more hijinks on RPGNet?
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Nunya B
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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by Nunya B » Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:16 pm

This discrimination against Nazis has got to end.

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Batgirl III
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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by Batgirl III » Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:39 pm

These days, everyone is a “Nazi.” The term has zero value other than a vague ‘this person has political views that do not align with mine.’
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Ken
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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by Ken » Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:13 am

They were specific enough to say 'self-identify as a Nazi' which means that their message is for a fairly small number of people.

Most people don't self-identify as Nazis. The term gets bandied about so much that it has, as Batgirl said, become meaningless. But in that bandying it is always as an accusation.

Which basically means that the Onyx Path is basically just virtue signalling.
What kind of crap glass was used in the windows of Wayne Manor (post-Crisis) that an animal with a mass of less than 27 grams (i.e. weighs less than an ounce) could break through it?

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Ares
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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by Ares » Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:06 am

Spectrum wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:40 pm
Err... more hijinks on RPGNet?
Yeah, I glanced over there and apparently one of the Vampire Clans in the new version of V:tM is going to have a sub-set that self-identifies as Nazis because it helps their agenda. So someone over on RPG.net interpreted that as the company actively appealing to Nazi's, rather than the idea of "Many, if not most, vampires are monsters and will do bad things".

https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?83 ... ence-Nazis

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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by Batgirl III » Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:11 am

See... that’s the other thing, “Nazi” is so commonly used as a slur that a lot of people are convinced that self-identifying as something completely banal is the same as being a uniformed member of the Gestapo.

“Oh, he’s a member of his church’s Knights of Columbus chapter? He’s a @&$#% Nazi!”

“Oh, she was a member of the Young Republicans at her university during the Reagan Administration? She’s a @&$#% Nazi!”

And so on and so forth...

Here’s my personal guideline on when it is “okay” to call someone a @&$#% Nazi:

• They are a willing member of the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei;
• They are a willing member of any other National Socialist political party (such as, but not limited to, the National Socialist Party of America or Ḥizb Al-Ba‘th Al-‘Arabī Al-Ishtirākī);
• They are an active and willing supporter of the same.
• They are the Red Skull, Ultra-Humanite, or Captain Nazi.

That’s it. Those are the only situations in which it is acceptable to call someone a @&$#% Nazi.
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Ken
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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by Ken » Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:18 am

Batgirl III wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:11 am
• They are a willing member of the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei;
• They are a willing member of any other National Socialist political party (such as, but not limited to, the National Socialist Party of America or Ḥizb Al-Ba‘th Al-‘Arabī Al-Ishtirākī);
• They are an active and willing supporter of the same.
• They are the Red Skull, Ultra-Humanite, or Captain Nazi.

That’s it. Those are the only situations in which it is acceptable to call someone a @&$#% Nazi.
That's not fair. Ultra-Humanite wasn't a Nazi. Evil genius with a totalitarian bent, sure. But he wasn't a Nazi.

Baron Blitzkrieg, Zyklon, Red Panzer? Sure. They were Nazis.
What kind of crap glass was used in the windows of Wayne Manor (post-Crisis) that an animal with a mass of less than 27 grams (i.e. weighs less than an ounce) could break through it?

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Batgirl III
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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by Batgirl III » Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:42 am

I was thinking specifically of the Ultra-Humanite that had Hitler’s brain.
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Sidious
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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by Sidious » Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:44 am

You forgot Baron Blood and the entirety of the Ubersoldaten.

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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by FuzzyBoots » Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:29 am

Ken wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:13 am
Which basically means that the Onyx Path is basically just virtue signalling.
Eh, to be fair, in the current political climate, that's "virtue signalling" in the same way as the people who disavowed Communist ties during the McCarthy era.

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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by BriarThrone » Fri Jul 13, 2018 10:31 am

FuzzyBoots wrote:
Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:29 am
Ken wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:13 am
Which basically means that the Onyx Path is basically just virtue signalling.
Eh, to be fair, in the current political climate, that's "virtue signalling" in the same way as the people who disavowed Communist ties during the McCarthy era.
The difference being, of course, that actual Neo-Nazis in the Western world are slightly less common than professional cryptozoologists, while Moscow definitely did have a lot of agents in both Hollywood and Washington. They're not looking for ACTUAL Nazis. They're looking for people to SMEAR as Nazis.

Onyx Path irritates the crap out of me with its embrace of the post-modernist nutjobs, but here, I don't think they're doing anything particularly egregious in this case. They make a game where you can roleplay as a monstrous rape allegory with extreme moral relativism. In a book about those monsters, it apparently mentions that a few of them find it advantageous to disingenuously present themselves as followers of a horrible ideology. That message board, entirely on board with being a bloodthirsty predator that blights humanity, erupts in wild accusations of endorsement of said ideology. Of course. Not surprised OP would respond with "FFS, WHAT ARE YOU ASSHOLES THINKING?"

I know for a fact that there are many communists and socialists on that board, open and proud.

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Ares
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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by Ares » Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:35 pm

I mean, Onyx Path put out Beast the Primordial. Clearly there are some messed up people there. But I find this whole mess to be incredibly disingenuous. At least when superheroes uses Nazis, they're actual supervillains. The Perpetually Outraged/Offended crowd have turned it into a word for anyone whose views they don't agree with. That's incredibly disrespectful to history and folks, living and dead, that suffered at their hands.

Vampires are often criminals as well. Where are the people outraged that the game is appealing to criminals?

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Re: Onyx Path is Not for... Nazis?

Post by Ares » Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:52 pm

On the plus side, the article that started this whole mess has been deleted and RPG.net topic about it has been closed. Apparently the article's creator got hit with certain facts that forced them to delete the post and post up a non-apology, and the thread debate became a mess when people actually started arguing against some of the points in a way that couldn't be refuted.

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