So, guess who got his first RPG.net ban?

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Ken
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Re: So, guess who got his first RPG.net ban?

Post by Ken » Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:25 am

Jabroniville wrote:
Mon Apr 03, 2017 11:50 pm
but as something that's an annoyance- when the "dominant culture" just sort of gobbles up everything from everyone else and makes it their own.
How many non-Irish people wear green and drink green beer and eat corned beef and cabbage on 17 March?

How many non-Germans celebrate Oktoberfest in the fall?

Cinquo de Mayo, anyone?

I live near enough to Chicago that I've been to some of their very Polish-themed fests.

Ethnic bits being absorbed into the larger cuture happens. A lot.

There used to be the idea of "the Great Melting Pot". It was all the rage for a long while in the U.S. I believe it was in Canada too. And if one finds that bits of their ethnic identity have made it into the larger cultural zeitgeist then, congratulations, your ethnic group is finding genuine acceptance within the larger culture.

Nothing is being taken from anyone. Everyone still has whatever ethnic culture they feel they have the right to. But to say "It's mine, and you can't share it", that kind of behaviour makes the person saying that an outsider.
Does a Winnie poo in the 100-acre wood?

Jabroniville
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Re: So, guess who got his first RPG.net ban?

Post by Jabroniville » Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:40 am

A lot of people, while complaining about being outsiders, go out of their way to BE outsiders. I've witnessed it a lot- most of the biracial people I know deliberately and outwardly identify with the more "minority-status" half of their make-up, regardless of whether or not that would be beneficial to them in society. Even the Half-Natives I know do this, and being Native-looking is DEFINITELY not a benefit in Canadian society. One girl I know even deliberately tanned and darkened her skin to look more like a minority.

And yeah, the melting-pot thing slams up against cultural identity- it used to be assumed that EVERYBODY should form up with the dominant culture in the US & Canada. There were of course places for the more insular cultures, and you still had neighborhoods made up mostly of certain ethnic groups- the "melting pot" was only ever a THEORY- not something that ever became true reality or even an "ideal" for some.

BriarThrone
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Re: So, guess who got his first RPG.net ban?

Post by BriarThrone » Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:53 am

Jabroniville wrote:
Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:40 am
A lot of people, while complaining about being outsiders, go out of their way to BE outsiders. I've witnessed it a lot- most of the biracial people I know deliberately and outwardly identify with the more "minority-status" half of their make-up, regardless of whether or not that would be beneficial to them in society. Even the Half-Natives I know do this, and being Native-looking is DEFINITELY not a benefit in Canadian society. One girl I know even deliberately tanned and darkened her skin to look more like a minority.

And yeah, the melting-pot thing slams up against cultural identity- it used to be assumed that EVERYBODY should form up with the dominant culture in the US & Canada. There were of course places for the more insular cultures, and you still had neighborhoods made up mostly of certain ethnic groups- the "melting pot" was only ever a THEORY- not something that ever became true reality or even an "ideal" for some.
It used to be a lot closer to true than it currently is. I live in an area that has a lot of history of Italian, Irish, and German immigration. There is virtually no one left who speaks Italian, Gaelic, or German. The one guy I know that does speak Italian is "suspected" of being a major regional figure in organized crime, and he's not exactly a young man.

On the other hand, nearby are several small communities of immigrants from various locations in the Third World. Lots of welfare benefits - I know because of how I see them pay in grocery stores. Lots of small ethnic shops designed to cater to those small communities. Very little reason to leave those small enclaves and begin to integrate. This creates a lack of opportunity for the young people, who are frustrated by their inability to escape these self-contained communities, which creates massive resentment and crime problems. Often directed at the people who are allegedly responsible for "keeping them down," despite not actually doing anything to prevent them from integrating besides ignorantly providing financial disincentive to integrate.

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Arkrite
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Re: So, guess who got his first RPG.net ban?

Post by Arkrite » Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:03 am

BriarThrone wrote:
Mon Apr 03, 2017 11:01 pm
To have that kind of disposable income to throw at dealing with my personal fashion insecurities? I still have shirts in my closet from '02! Most white people I knew growing up *snip*
Okay, lets try to avoid attacking other people.
It's fine to bring a counterpoint to their statements, but we should try to treat other people the way we want to be treated.

The swearing isn't really necessary and, if only in my opinion, hurts your own argument. I'm far more sympathetic to the victim of such actions, and far less likely to take the person using such language seriously.

Being passionate is good, but being angry and mad is a quick way to lose any headway you're hoping to make.
Are you more likely to listen to a calm rational man who quietly makes his points, or the man who's yelling and screaming? I can't speak for you, but I tend to ignore the angry guy regardless.

As for the statement about money, we don't know anything about the person in question so why should we judging them?
For all our knowledge they work overtime and nights and it's their only treat. Heck, the money in question seems large as a lump sum, but broken down it comes out to around what I've heard people normally pay for haircuts.

If you want to take a crack at somebody for poor spending habits feel free to take a swing at me. I like spending my money on comic books, movies, novels, soda, ice cream and RPGs.
It's a frivolous waste of money, but it's my money, I earned it and I have the right to spend it how I like.

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Re: So, guess who got his first RPG.net ban?

Post by Jabroniville » Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:06 am

BriarThrone wrote:
Mon Apr 03, 2017 11:01 pm
MissRo wrote:
Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:53 pm
It's shameful and embarrassing for me to admit this, but I spend anywhere from $1000 to $1200 a year just to keep my hair relaxed. I can't stand to look at myself in the mirror when it starts getting nappy.

It's hard to understand what it's like to be a visible minority unless you've lived the life.
Holy crap, yeah, I have a hard time understanding that life. To have that kind of disposable income to throw at dealing with my personal fashion insecurities? I still have shirts in my closet from '02! Most white people I knew growing up would have had to just learn to deal with it, but if you're so privileged that you can pay to make it go away, I guess... congratulations?
Hey now, MissRo is rad- she doesn't deserve that. For shame, Briar.

The whole thing with "Good Hair" is a very deep, cultural thing. Chris Rock did a great documentary called Good Hair about hair culture in black communities (a HUGE portion of sales in hair care are to black women), and how there are expectations to look a certain way. The documentary points out that the desire for "long, straight, thick hair" is a near-universal thing, not just an American one, and there are intense pressures to look a certain way.

And we're Canadian. Up until recently our economy was doing super-rad. I've checked my privilege against your poor Americans more than once over it ;).

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L-Space
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Re: So, guess who got his first RPG.net ban?

Post by L-Space » Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:06 am

Arkrite wrote:
Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:03 am
BriarThrone wrote:
Mon Apr 03, 2017 11:01 pm
To have that kind of disposable income to throw at dealing with my personal fashion insecurities? I still have shirts in my closet from '02! Most white people I knew growing up *snip*
Okay, lets try to avoid attacking other people.
It's fine to bring a counterpoint to their statements, but we should try to treat other people the way we want to be treated.

The swearing isn't really necessary and, if only in my opinion, hurts your own argument. I'm far more sympathetic to the victim of such actions, and far less likely to take the person using such language seriously.

Being passionate is good, but being angry and mad is a quick way to lose any headway you're hoping to make.
Are you more likely to listen to a calm rational man who quietly makes his points, or the man who's yelling and screaming? I can't speak for you, but I tend to ignore the angry guy regardless.

As for the statement about money, we don't know anything about the person in question so why should we judging them?
For all our knowledge they work overtime and nights and it's their only treat. Heck, the money in question seems large as a lump sum, but broken down it comes out to around what I've heard people normally pay for haircuts.

If you want to take a crack at somebody for poor spending habits feel free to take a swing at me. I like spending my money on comic books, movies, novels, soda, ice cream and RPGs.
It's a frivolous waste of money, but it's my money, I earned it and I have the right to spend it how I like.
Well put Arkrite.

As for RPG.net (the original reason for this thread ;)) it seems like their Mods are too similar to RoninArmy's for my tastes.
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Jabroniville
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Re: So, guess who got his first RPG.net ban?

Post by Jabroniville » Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:08 am

Yeah, I think scaling back the language and snarky attitude is a good thing. It's never good to get worked up, especially in the internet, when someone can easily misread tone or intent.

Like, this is just Ares venting about RPGnet doing some dumb stuff. Let's not have the full culture war against political correctness right in the here and now :). Hell, this topic's already gone to three pages in a couple of days- it's busier than MY thread *sniff*...

BriarThrone
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Re: So, guess who got his first RPG.net ban?

Post by BriarThrone » Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:41 am

Arkrite wrote:
Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:03 am
BriarThrone wrote:
Mon Apr 03, 2017 11:01 pm
To have that kind of disposable income to throw at dealing with my personal fashion insecurities? I still have shirts in my closet from '02! Most white people I knew growing up *snip*
Okay, lets try to avoid attacking other people.
It's fine to bring a counterpoint to their statements, but we should try to treat other people the way we want to be treated.
Exactly so. If I made a claim that spending a thousand dollars a year to satisfy my personal vanity was a symbol of my oppression, I'd want to be called out on it. Sweet Christmas, for some people's problems.
Arkrite wrote:
Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:03 am
The swearing isn't really necessary and, if only in my opinion, hurts your own argument. I'm far more sympathetic to the victim of such actions, and far less likely to take the person using such language seriously.
Victim, eh? What's the damages? I'll gladly pay for any actual bodily harm that my snark has done.

EDIT: Wait, are we still talking about the MissRo post? Because there was no profanity in that one at all. Focus! If you can't pay attention to what you're doing, you're a failure even as a White Knight! Failure of a failure state... too disgraceful for words.
Arkrite wrote:
Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:03 am
Being passionate is good, but being angry and mad is a quick way to lose any headway you're hoping to make.
Are you more likely to listen to a calm rational man who quietly makes his points, or the man who's yelling and screaming? I can't speak for you, but I tend to ignore the angry guy regardless.
Who's angry? I think it's hilarious.
Arkrite wrote:
Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:03 am
As for the statement about money, we don't know anything about the person in question so why should we judging them?
We know that the person in question pays a grand and change to make her hair look different, because she personally didn't like how it looked, and acted like it was the tragic burden minorities faced. It is my tragic burden to pay maybe $160-200 in haircuts per year, because I decided to take it up a notch and get the pretty ladies massaging my scalp. Miss Ro's stack of cash doesn't even cover the styling, just the relaxing. Which, again, is fine, as long as she acknowledges that it is her vanity she's addressing, instead of blaming society for her hangups.
Arkrite wrote:
Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:03 am
For all our knowledge they work overtime and nights and it's their only treat. Heck, the money in question seems large as a lump sum, but broken down it comes out to around what I've heard people normally pay for haircuts.

If you want to take a crack at somebody for poor spending habits feel free to take a swing at me. I like spending my money on comic books, movies, novels, soda, ice cream and RPGs.
It's a frivolous waste of money, but it's my money, I earned it and I have the right to spend it how I like.
And if that's what Miss Ro wants to do with her money, that's more than okay with me. If she got her jollies lighting it on fire in front of poor people, I would have no objection to that. My objection comes from the idea that she presented an issue of personal vanity as if it was society's fault.
Last edited by BriarThrone on Tue Apr 04, 2017 2:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Tattooedman
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Re: So, guess who got his first RPG.net ban?

Post by Tattooedman » Tue Apr 04, 2017 2:19 am

Yeah, that smacks big time (to me at least) of what happened on RA forum.

-Don't question the decisions/actions of the Mods, or you shall be punished!!!

Glad I didn't go to that forum.

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Ares
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Re: So, guess who got his first RPG.net ban?

Post by Ares » Tue Apr 04, 2017 3:32 am

Jabroniville wrote:
Tue Apr 04, 2017 1:08 am
Yeah, I think scaling back the language and snarky attitude is a good thing. It's never good to get worked up, especially in the internet, when someone can easily misread tone or intent.

Like, this is just Ares venting about RPGnet doing some dumb stuff. Let's not have the full culture war against political correctness right in the here and now :). Hell, this topic's already gone to three pages in a couple of days- it's busier than MY thread *sniff*...
Indeed. So:

I appreciate the sympathy regarding the ban. But I feel this topic has run its course and we're now getting a bit too heated for something that was just me complaining to a sympathetic audience about something I felt was stupid. And I thank you guys for that.

If someone wishes to start this debate with a clean slate over in the Debate thread, I have no problem with that. The one thing I will continue to stress is that we do so in a civil way. And while doing so, remember the medium we're in opens itself up to interpretation depending on your mood and the mood of the reader. So speak your mind, but mind your words.

So, lets get back to business as usual.

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