Experimental House Rules for M&M

A place to discuss game rules, homebrew systems and the like.
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Davies
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Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by Davies »

These are some notions that I've been considering, somewhat gelled into their current form in response to That Sullivan Guy's writings on his own house rules, some of which match my own (Fearless being replaced by a two level bonus to certain saves.) I welcome commentary concerning them.

Languages and Comprehend Languages

These are some of the most annoying traits in the system, and don't really reflect the way that comic book reality works. Generally, no matter the language barrier -- there's either someone present who understands what's being said, the characters know just enough to figure out the gist, and translator devices are common. So basically, a language barrier is best represented by a Complication for the players, rather than requiring them to have purchased a trait to overcome the situation.

But about characters like Cypher, whose power is the ability to understand any language? Well, in addition to giving his powers giving a bonus to his Technology skill that applies only to Computer Use, he gets a Feature (multilingual). This means that he can't normally be subjected to a language barrier Complication, unless he's also subjected to a Power Loss complication, getting two hero points for his trouble.

Being able to Comprehend entities that don't have language, as far as we can tell, should still be a power.

Mulitple Die Rolls

Does rolling 3d20, and keeping the roll that is neither the highest nor the lowest of the three, generate a curve?

Does spending a hero point for being able to roll 3d20 and take the highest of the three rolls take the place of the normal "roll again and take +10 if you rolled under 10" rule? What if you still add 10 if the highest of the three rolls is under 10?

Does getting a hero point make up for situations where you have to roll 3d20 and take the lowest of the three rolls?
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MacynSnow
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by MacynSnow »

I personally consider Cypher's ability to also mean Combat Languages as well(basically, he'd be able to temporarily pick up a Combat Advantage so long as it was physically seen. Kinda like a weaker version of Taskmaster's ability).
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by MacynSnow »

As for the 3d20 roll, it unfortunately creates a straight line. Take it from someone who ran Star Trek Adventures for a good while,it doesn't help with Bell curves AT ALL.
Shock
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by Shock »

In general, I'm not a fan of reducing the incidence of crits too much. To me, that's when interesting things happen. But 3d20 take the middle is definitely not a straight line

I found this showing the curve when using 3d20 take the middle. Source

Image


I'm in agreement about languages, in general. Being unable to communicate is something that can be interesting in a story but in a game it's just a hindrance to keeping things moving. Though I'm sure a creative GM could make it interesting occasionally. Your solution looks as good to me at first glance. The only quirk I see is that there may be times when you're kicking yourself for taking a power or Feature that seems to actually deprive you of Hero points.
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Davies
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by Davies »

Okay. This is what the three main dice rolls I propose end up looking like. I don't know enough about programming to add the 'if you roll less than 10, add 10 to the roll" function, but from the looks of the 'highest of 3d20' line, I'm unsure that it's needed.
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by Shock »

If you want to do 'if you roll less than 10, add 10 to the roll' change the roll to d10+10.
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Davies
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by Davies »

Shock wrote: Sun Feb 07, 2021 2:34 pm If you want to do 'if you roll less than 10, add 10 to the roll' change the roll to d10+10.
:oops: Okay, so this is what 'roll 3d20, keep the middle', 'roll 3d20, keep the highest', 'roll 3d20, keep the highest, if the highest is less than 10 add 10 to it', and RAW 'roll d20, if the roll is less than 10 add 10 to it' look like by comparison. That third one looks wicked steep.
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Davies
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by Davies »

What does it do if we do this?

Roll with Advantage: Roll 3d20, keep highest.
Roll with Disadvantage: Roll 3d20, take lowest.

Accurate Attack (Maneuver): You have a +2 to your next attack, but your opponent's Toughness check is made at +2.
Accurate Attack (Advantage): You roll your next attack with advantage, but your opponent's Toughness check is made with advantage.

All-Out Attack (Maneuver): You have a +2 to your next attack, but anyone who attacks you also gets a +2 bonus to their attack.
All-Out Attack (Advantage): You roll your next attack with advantage, but anyone who attacks you for the rest of your turn rolls their attack with advantage.

Defensive Attack (Maneuver): Any attack made against you is made at -2, but any attack you make is also made at -2.
Defensive Attack (Advantage): Any attack made against you is made at disadvantage, but any attack you make is also made at disadvantage.

Power Attack (Maneuver): You have a -2 to your next attack, but your opponent's Toughness check is made at -2.
Power Attack (Advantage): You roll your next attack with disadvantage, but your opponent's Toughness check is made with disadvantage.

A spent hero point:
1) Grants any advantage you don't have, or
2) Lets you roll with advantage and add 10 to any roll under 10, or
3) Eliminates any disadvantage you're under, or
4) Other cool stuff.
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Shock
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by Shock »

Rolling with advantage is a big swing over rolling with +2. Average of 15.5 vs average of 12.5. And the +2 doesn't give you the increased chance of a crit. As you see from the table you generated, it's over 14% chance of crit with advantage vs less than 1% normally.

My gut feeling is the D&D 5E version with 1d20 normally and 2 with advantage or disadvantage is probably more equitable. Advantage giving that 14.7% chance of a crit is going to lead to everyone trying to maximize their chances of getting advantage over just about anything else.
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Davies
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by Davies »

Grabs and Athletics

Inspired by how Pathfinder 2 does it, what happens if we use Athletics to make and resist Grabs? What if Elongation adds to that roll, and its maximum rank is determined by the skill bonus limit, instead of the attack bonus limit?
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squirrelly-sama
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by squirrelly-sama »

Davies wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 7:03 pm Grabs and Athletics

Inspired by how Pathfinder 2 does it, what happens if we use Athletics to make and resist Grabs? What if Elongation adds to that roll, and its maximum rank is determined by the skill bonus limit, instead of the attack bonus limit?
It'd make grabs more powerful. It increases the potential DC to save against somewhat dramatically while the average resistance will probably remain about the same. It also reduces the price of Grabbing, which inflicts a rather useful affliction, by about a quarter since you're buying up a skill over an ability score.
Rydacted
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by Rydacted »

Hey Guys,
As a mini house rule, when using 3d20, I allow crits to be on either 19 or 20 (before taking upto 4 ranks of improved crit) for 'Supers'. That is a 2.8% chance rather than 5% on a 20 on a 1d20.

Also, first post :)
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Davies
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by Davies »

What happens if range is not exclusive, but additive?

There's already some of this in the Rules As Written. When you apply a +1 Affects Others and Self extra to a Personal range effect, you can (like it says on the box) use it on others at Close Range, as well as yourself. Technically, you have to apply a different +1 Attack extra to use it on unwilling targets, but the language of Close range on p. 147 says that you can use a Close Range effect on 'anyone and anything you can touch' -- which would tend to include one's own self.

What if this is extended? What if, on buying a Ranged effect, you can also use it as a Close effect, with the attack roll based on Fighting and the Defense based on Parry, and the possibility of a critical hit? And what if, on buying a Perception effect, you can also use it as a Ranged effect, with an attack roll based on Dexterity and a Defense based on Dodge, the penalties for range, and the possibility of a critical hit ... and as a Close effect, as above?

Even equipment might benefit from this -- the classic "we were struggling and the gun went off" situation would seem like the sort of thing that would be resolved with a Fighting vs. Parry check.

This would be an exception to the 'you always have to use a +1/rank extra' rule, which could create some confusion, however.
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by FuzzyBoots »

As per this Reddit post, I've found myself wondering what it would be like if Afflictions, like Damage, didn't just go away with no action. Even requiring a Move action to get the save to recover would make them a bit more powerful, requiring people to weigh whether it makes more sense to just have that -2 from Impaired, or to take an action to try a save against the effect. Maybe Instant Recovery could return it to that baseline, so things like being tripped (rendered Prone) take an action to get out of rather than the effect just magically bringing you back to standing the next round.

Or, alternately, maybe allowing this as a +1 Extra, as per Tipop's suggestion?
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Re: Experimental House Rules for M&M

Post by Shock »

Davies wrote: Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:59 pm What happens if range is not exclusive, but additive?

There's already some of this in the Rules As Written. When you apply a +1 Affects Others and Self extra to a Personal range effect, you can (like it says on the box) use it on others at Close Range, as well as yourself. Technically, you have to apply a different +1 Attack extra to use it on unwilling targets, but the language of Close range on p. 147 says that you can use a Close Range effect on 'anyone and anything you can touch' -- which would tend to include one's own self.

What if this is extended? What if, on buying a Ranged effect, you can also use it as a Close effect, with the attack roll based on Fighting and the Defense based on Parry, and the possibility of a critical hit? And what if, on buying a Perception effect, you can also use it as a Ranged effect, with an attack roll based on Dexterity and a Defense based on Dodge, the penalties for range, and the possibility of a critical hit ... and as a Close effect, as above?

Even equipment might benefit from this -- the classic "we were struggling and the gun went off" situation would seem like the sort of thing that would be resolved with a Fighting vs. Parry check.

This would be an exception to the 'you always have to use a +1/rank extra' rule, which could create some confusion, however.
Being able to choose which defense you attack is a pretty strong ability. However, since you can get the same thing for a 1 point alternate effect, it probably would not adversely impact gameplay all that much.
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