Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

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Thorpocalypse
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Thorpocalypse » Mon Jul 23, 2018 2:00 am

It gave me hope that at least there will be some decent comedy in it. The kids that play Billy and Freddy seem to have good chemistry. I have Billy Batson-like hope that it will be decent.
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Ares
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Ares » Mon Jul 23, 2018 5:19 am

Thorpocalypse wrote:
Mon Jul 23, 2018 2:00 am
It gave me hope that at least there will be some decent comedy in it. The kids that play Billy and Freddy seem to have good chemistry. I have Billy Batson-like hope that it will be decent.
I appreciate that sentiment Thorp, and like I said, there are things I liked about that trailer. But DC has done me wrong one time too many with the Marvel Family, and I refuse to give them any of my cash for this. I'm going to wait for it to come out on Netflix.

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Ares
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Ares » Sun Aug 05, 2018 10:05 pm

So I went on vacation with my family earlier this week, and on the drive I got into a debate with my youngest brother regarding the Shazam movie, and we basically agreed that a lot of the elements in the trailer and movie aren't bad in and of themselves. The idea of a kid having a hard life, being a jerk because of it, gaining superpowers, having fun with them and being a bit of a tool with them before his friendship with others and family help humanize isn't bad. I mean, that's basically the Peter Parker story with the exception of Peter not being a jerk before he gets his powers.

That's just a a poor fit for Captain Marvel and Billy Batson. Billy isn't suppose to be an "ordinary kid", he's suppose to be an extraordinary one, which is why he gets picked by the Wizard in the first place.

We live in a world where kids like Cris "Kesz" Valdez exist. Watch the video. I'll wait. If our world can produce a kid like that, then I expect no less from Billy Batson. What can I say, I have standards.

I mean, Shazam is being billed as "Big with Super-Powers", except the kid in Big wasn't an asshole. This Billy is someone who steals from others, destroys their property, is dismissive of people trying to be his friends, laughs at the Wizard's name, and otherwise acts like the worst kind of jock/dude-bro once he gets his powers.

Billy should have the same kind of problem that Steve Rogers had in the first Capt. America film: not that he was a bad person who gained power and learned to be a better person because of it, but that he was a good person who lacked the power to really make use of his good intentions, and needs to figure out how best to make use of his new abilities. At this point, the "jerk with a heart of gold" storyline is so overdone it would actually be more subversive to just have Billy be a good kid from the word "go".

I mean, if they wanted to do a story about a kid with kind of a rough life who was kind of a jerk who gets lightning related superpowers and has to learn to be a hero because of his friends and family, why not do a Static movie? Get another black superhero on screen.

What's that, fans of Static? Virgil was always a good kid, his first story before he got his powers was him choosing to NOT murder someone just because it was expected of a kid to "be a man", and the first thing he did with his powers was decide to be a superhero? Why thank you, you just proved my point.

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Batgirl III
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Batgirl III » Sun Aug 05, 2018 10:17 pm

I mean, if they wanted to do a story about a kid with kind of a rough life who was kind of a jerk who gets insect-related superpowers and has to learn to be a hero because of his friends and family, why not do a Jaime Reyes/Blue Beetle movie? Get another brown superhero on screen.
Fixed that for you. :lol:
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Ares
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Ares » Sun Aug 05, 2018 10:28 pm

Batgirl III wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 10:17 pm
Fixed-
NO. No, you did not. The analogy worked just fine the way it was. Especially given the follow up paragraph. But again, like Billy and Virgil, Jaime was (at least originally) always a good kid who didn't need to go through any "jerk with a heart of gold" moments to figure out who he was. The sad thing is that since making Cyborg this Mother Box Bot, he's basically capable of everything Jaime is power wise.

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Batgirl III
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Batgirl III » Sun Aug 05, 2018 11:13 pm

Ares wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 10:28 pm
Batgirl III wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 10:17 pm
Fixed-
Why thank you, Batgirl. You are truly the most helpful and least sarcastic poster on this message board. I wish you long life and much happiness.
Fixed it for you again, Ares. I think your autocorrect may be acting up. :D
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Ares
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Ares » Sun Aug 05, 2018 11:25 pm

So, I realize you have no way of knowing this BG, but the whole "Fixed it for you" and "editing your post that I'm quoting" things that you're doing in obvious good fun? That's a long-time pet peeve of mine that you are legitimately ticking me off with. I realize you didn't know, you're just being you, it was all in good fun, and I'm not asking you to go back and edit anything for my tender sensibilities. I am asking you as one poster to another to knock it off, at least with me. Please.

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Batgirl III
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Batgirl III » Sun Aug 05, 2018 11:50 pm

You got it, Ares. No harm intended, but I understand why it could come across as far ruder than intended. I'll knock it off. :)
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Ares
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Ares » Mon Aug 06, 2018 3:15 am

Thanks. Like I said, I know you meant nothing by it, it's just something that gets on my nerves some days more than others. Especially these days when you have people actually going "You say this but what you really mean is THIS!" I acknowledge I'm the one with the issue here.

Chris Brady
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Chris Brady » Mon Aug 06, 2018 11:15 pm

What the $#!& is 'Brown'? There are three types of humans, Caucasoid, Negroid and Mongoloid, each with their unique facial and biological appearance, 'Brown' is not one of them!

RUSCHE
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by RUSCHE » Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:43 am

How did a question about whether you liked or did not like the Captain Marvel/Shazam trailer lead to the diversity of the human species?

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Ares
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Ares » Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:22 pm

RUSCHE wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:43 am
How did a question about whether you liked or did not like the Captain Marvel/Shazam trailer lead to the diversity of the human species?
Hell if I know.

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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by RUSCHE » Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:41 pm

Ares wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:22 pm
RUSCHE wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:43 am
How did a question about whether you liked or did not like the Captain Marvel/Shazam trailer lead to the diversity of the human species?
Hell if I know.
Me either, I like your take on how Billy and Steve though. Billy is a exceptional person and should be shown as such in all representations ie: movies , comics ect.

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Ares
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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by Ares » Tue Aug 07, 2018 3:04 pm

RUSCHE wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:41 pm
Ares wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:22 pm
RUSCHE wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:43 am
How did a question about whether you liked or did not like the Captain Marvel/Shazam trailer lead to the diversity of the human species?
Hell if I know.
Me either, I like your take on how Billy and Steve though. Billy is a exceptional person and should be shown as such in all representations ie: movies , comics ect.
Yeah, I think a lot of people confuse the idea that Billy is someone they can relate to with the idea that Billy is "the average joe". It's sort the same thing with Peter Parker. Peter is someone everyone says they can relate to, but at the same time, Peter is someone with a genius intellect rivaling Tony Stark, is good looking, great shape, very funny and possesses a degree of courage, heroism and capacity for self-sacrifice that not everyone has. But people can relate to Peter because he has the same problems as everyone else, he enjoys the same kind of entertainment as other people, he has people he loves, a job that is often frustrating but equally rewarding, he deals with stress via humor, etc.

Peter is someone folks can relate to, but he isn't the "average joe". Billy Batson should likewise be someone folks can relate to and empathize with, someone who enjoys a wide range of stuff from the normal to the geeky, he has to deal with things like the loss of people he loves, trying to keep his family together, etc.

I wish I could find the interview, but Geoff Johns once said that if Billy Batson could be a young kid who was as moral and responsible as Superman, then he'd be an extraordinary kid, perhaps unbelievably so. Which just goes to show that Johns completely missed the point with Billy, and why I have no faith in his interpretation of the character. He claimed he made Billy "prickly", which I suppose sounds better in his head than "self-absorbed douchebag with a hidden nugget of not-so-bad tucked inside of him".

Billy Batson is suppose to be an extraordinary young man with the same kind of ordinary issues life throws at all of us. How he deals with them is suppose to be both relatable and inspiring, instead of being someone who takes the low road. Billy is perhaps one of the first examples of an emancipated child who lived on his own, had his own job, and thus had to deal with the issues of an adult and a child even before he says his magic word.

Because that's something no one seems to get about Billy, and why his popularity endures. To a kid, Billy Batson is awesome because he's someone like themselves who says a magic word and gets to be an adult superhero. To an adult, they get to imagine being an adult superhero who says a word and goes back to being a kid. Children relate to the fun Billy gets to have while being educated on the responsibilities of an adult, while adults recognize the things Billy has to deal with and enjoy Billy reminding them to have fun, to get an injection of some of that childlike wonder and enthusiasm Billy has.

I know, I'm rambling, and at this point most of you can probably call my statements point by point. It's just frustrating that Billy keeps getting put into the hands of people that fundamentally don't understand him. While not quite on the level of Hydra-Cap betrayal, it's a similar level of frustration.

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Re: Captain Marvel trailer(original Captain Marvel)

Post by RUSCHE » Tue Aug 07, 2018 3:16 pm

Ares wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 3:04 pm
RUSCHE wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:41 pm
Ares wrote:
Tue Aug 07, 2018 2:22 pm


Hell if I know.
Me either, I like your take on how Billy and Steve though. Billy is a exceptional person and should be shown as such in all representations ie: movies , comics ect.
Yeah, I think a lot of people confuse the idea that Billy is someone they can relate to with the idea that Billy is "the average joe". It's sort the same thing with Peter Parker. Peter is someone everyone says they can relate to, but at the same time, Peter is someone with a genius intellect rivaling Tony Stark, is good looking, great shape, very funny and possesses a degree of courage, heroism and capacity for self-sacrifice that not everyone has. But people can relate to Peter because he has the same problems as everyone else, he enjoys the same kind of entertainment as other people, he has people he loves, a job that is often frustrating but equally rewarding, he deals with stress via humor, etc.

Peter is someone folks can relate to, but he isn't the "average joe". Billy Batson should likewise be someone folks can relate to and empathize with, someone who enjoys a wide range of stuff from the normal to the geeky, he has to deal with things like the loss of people he loves, trying to keep his family together, etc.

I wish I could find the interview, but Geoff Johns once said that if Billy Batson could be a young kid who was as moral and responsible as Superman, then he'd be an extraordinary kid, perhaps unbelievably so. Which just goes to show that Johns completely missed the point with Billy, and why I have no faith in his interpretation of the character. He claimed he made Billy "prickly", which I suppose sounds better in his head than "self-absorbed douchebag with a hidden nugget of not-so-bad tucked inside of him".

Billy Batson is suppose to be an extraordinary young man with the same kind of ordinary issues life throws at all of us. How he deals with them is suppose to be both relatable and inspiring, instead of being someone who takes the low road. Billy is perhaps one of the first examples of an emancipated child who lived on his own, had his own job, and thus had to deal with the issues of an adult and a child even before he says his magic word.

Because that's something no one seems to get about Billy, and why his popularity endures. To a kid, Billy Batson is awesome because he's someone like themselves who says a magic word and gets to be an adult superhero. To an adult, they get to imagine being an adult superhero who says a word and goes back to being a kid. Children relate to the fun Billy gets to have while being educated on the responsibilities of an adult, while adults recognize the things Billy has to deal with and enjoy Billy reminding them to have fun, to get an injection of some of that childlike wonder and enthusiasm Billy has.

I know, I'm rambling, and at this point most of you can probably call my statements point by point. It's just frustrating that Billy keeps getting put into the hands of people that fundamentally don't understand him. While not quite on the level of Hydra-Cap betrayal, it's a similar level of frustration.
On this topic you can ramble all you want, my recent pet peeves are how matter of fact they treat Billy. Also in the same vein is how Steve Rogers and Thor were treated over the last 4 years plus. Why I love Billy was that through all the crap life tossed his way he never broke. Pete had his low points as all our heroes do, but Billy stood firm in his belief in good. Thor stands fast against evil and to see it destroyed, Steve sets a example of how good you can be and Billy sets a great example on how to face adversity and keep your chin up

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