Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

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Chris Brady
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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by Chris Brady » Thu Jul 19, 2018 5:45 am

Batgirl III wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:36 pm
Chris Brady wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 7:06 pm
It won't happen because it won't sell, and they know it. Because if actions movies with female leads sold, why hasn't Salt? Red Sparrow? These films MAY have made money, but not enough to justify a franchise.
Image
Budget: $78 million
Box office: $694.4 million
Rotten Tomatoes: 84% approval rating

Image
Budget: $130 million
Box office: $865 million
Rotten Tomatoes: 89% approval rating

Image
Budget: $140 million
Box office: $755.4 million
Rotten Tomatoes: 67% approval rating

Image
Budget: $160 million
Box office: $653.4 million
Rotten Tomatoes: 70% approval rating

Quod erat demonstrandum.
Exceptions do not make the rule.

Maybe the Black Widow movie will rock, I hope so! But it holds true, it's not going to do as hotly as the rest of the Marvel Movies of late.

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Batgirl III
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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by Batgirl III » Thu Jul 19, 2018 5:56 am

Well, they aren’t making a Black Widow movie, so...
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StarGuard
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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by StarGuard » Thu Sep 13, 2018 4:34 am

Which is a shame because Natasha rocks. They’d actually better off with less Widow and more Romanova. Her character made a great contrast to Rogers in Civil War and with her as the lead Clint of the MCU would be a great option with Chris no longer playing the Captain.

Yes stereotypically women leads are a tough sell, but just unlike Wonder Woman which I’d begged years for. Widow has a prebuilt in audience (which helped carry Antman and GotG initial movies). An audience which has clamored for a solo shot since her initial debut. If there is a stopper here it’s in the initial contract not paying enough for her to bother playing a leading role. IMO

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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by MorganBravestone » Thu Sep 20, 2018 11:25 pm

You can officially consider it no longer a rumour. I'm a 'people' and I want my all-female Avengers film. But first, I want a Black Widow film. To be honest, I don't really care about Infinity War 2 (or whatever it ends up being called). If I was given the option of 'Get the second half of the Infinity War saga but the Black Widow solo movie is delayed' or 'Get the Black Widow solo movie now, but we'll never make the second half of Infinity War, simply skipping to after it has all been resolved', then I would be all for junking the second Infinity War film right now.

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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by Woodclaw » Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:13 am

I would be very happy with a movie showing what happened in Budapest :P
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Chris Brady
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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by Chris Brady » Wed Sep 26, 2018 4:55 am

StarGuard wrote:
Thu Sep 13, 2018 4:34 am
Which is a shame because Natasha rocks. They’d actually better off with less Widow and more Romanova. Her character made a great contrast to Rogers in Civil War and with her as the lead Clint of the MCU would be a great option with Chris no longer playing the Captain.

Yes stereotypically women leads are a tough sell, but just unlike Wonder Woman which I’d begged years for. Widow has a prebuilt in audience (which helped carry Antman and GotG initial movies). An audience which has clamored for a solo shot since her initial debut. If there is a stopper here it’s in the initial contract not paying enough for her to bother playing a leading role. IMO
Thing is, we've HAD a Black Widow movie, though. It was called Red Sparrow. Other than the (comics version) super soldier serum, it pretty much breaks down into Widow's backstory. Former Ballerina, inducted into female only spy organization, a la Red Room, and sent off to work for Mother Russia.

And it bombed.

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Ares
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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by Ares » Wed Sep 26, 2018 5:17 am

I'm not sure that's a fair comparison.

For one thing, Red Sparrow doesn't have the MCU backing it. Thanks to the time and effort the MCU has put in, they can make virtually any movie from their setting and be guaranteed to make anywhere from a mild profit to a box office breaker. Just having it set in the MCU will draw people in, and the reliability of the MCU's films (20 movies and only one really bad one? That's an impressive track record) means people will trust it.

For another, one iteration of a film idea succeeding or failing doesn't mean any other attempt at a similar film will succeed or fail. I mean, Fox has tried three times to make a Fantastic Four movie, and all of them were different levels of bad, but that doesn't mean a Fantastic Four film can't work. The Incredibles is basically the Fantastic Four with the serial numbers filed off and it made bank both times. Atomic Blonde was an action spy thriller and it had a box office of about 100 million against a budget of 30 million, and a sequel is in the works.

I basically see no reason why a Black Widow movie couldn't work, especially if it's done in a vein similar to Capt. America: Winter Solider. And hey, I'm sure they could work in a cameo or tie-in to another Marvel property, like Shang Chi or Daredevil.

And all female Avengers movie? Meh, we've never really had an all male Avengers movie, so I don't see why we should get the inverse other than politics (which is my main concern with the Captain Marvel film). I don't think anyone is saying we don't want more female superheroes in these movies, but a specifically "all-female" squad seems weird.

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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by Chris Brady » Wed Sep 26, 2018 5:21 am

I'm not above being wrong. So far, evidence has said no. But if Captain Marvel does well (and I'm talking Ant-Man level numbers), it may prove that it's time.

We can't use Wonder Woman, simply because it's compared to the rest of the DC movies, and let's face it, that wasn't a high bar to clear.

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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by BriarThrone » Thu Sep 27, 2018 8:34 am

Chris Brady wrote:
Wed Sep 26, 2018 5:21 am
I'm not above being wrong. So far, evidence has said no. But if Captain Marvel does well (and I'm talking Ant-Man level numbers), it may prove that it's time.

We can't use Wonder Woman, simply because it's compared to the rest of the DC movies, and let's face it, that wasn't a high bar to clear.
Not sure that's fair. I'm not the world's biggest fan of the actress for Black Widow, but she's a proven box office draw, and the character is a fan favorite. Brie Larson is unproven (and unpromising), and Captain Marvel is not as established to the wider audience.

Hell, even in the comic book realm, Carol Danvers is basically two different characters - Ms Marvel, beautiful and respected veteran superhero, and Captain Marvel, wiry dude who is obviously a villain who inexplicably still hangs out with the heroes, gets a pass on villainous behavior based on some weird virtue credit system or something, and doesn't understand the dynamics of interpersonal relationships. There may be familiar old storylines here, but the character they're going with is the second one, and I'm not sure it's going to translate to the kind of box office returns they're hoping for. They've clearly got the Diversity Defense firmly in place already.

Black Widow hasn't had to carry the weight of being Marvel's centerpiece character while the company enthusiastically tries to commit suicide by drowning itself in the toilet. I think she's in a better position to star in a movie.

I think basing this on gender is, as always, a mistake. I think a Widow movie, made to the same standard as previous Marvel movies, could be pretty good. I don't think Marvel is relying on quality movie-making to make Captain Marvel work, so I'm not expecting much from it.

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Ares
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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by Ares » Thu Sep 27, 2018 4:52 pm

I'm also not sure why Wonder Woman wouldn't count. Adjusted for Ticket Price Inflation, the only MCU movies that did better than her film were Avengers 1, Black Panther, Infinity War, Age of Ultron, Iron Man 3 and Captain America Civil War. Having the sales numbers of an average MCU film is a solid showing for Wonder Woman, regardless of how crap the DCEU is by comparison.

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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by greycrusader » Thu Sep 27, 2018 8:16 pm

Chris Brady wrote:
Wed Sep 26, 2018 5:21 am
I'm not above being wrong. So far, evidence has said no. But if Captain Marvel does well (and I'm talking Ant-Man level numbers), it may prove that it's time.

We can't use Wonder Woman, simply because it's compared to the rest of the DC movies, and let's face it, that wasn't a high bar to clear.
Either a film makes money for its'studio or it doesn't; WW made on the order of $250-300 million clear profit BEFORE merchandising, dvd sales, redbox rentals, streaming, and cable rights, so yes, it counts.

The first Lara Croft movie made bank. Likewise Charlie's Angels, Maleficent, and Ant-Man and the Wasp, which was definitely Evangeline Lily's move to carry. On a smaller scale, so did Atomic Blonde, Salt, and Mad Max: Fury Road, which was really Charlize Theron's character Furiosa as the main protagonist. Then there are the Aliens, Halloween, Resident Evil series, all of which feature women as the main heroes.

The biggest weakness I see in the Captain Marvel movie is Brie Larson. Nothing against her as an actress, but she just seems too aloof and reserved for the role, as well as a bit youngish. But when had Paul Rudd ever done an action movie? Who was Chris Pratt except the overweight goofball fromParks and Rec? Why did Marvel stake anything on RDJ, a career drug addict/emotional train wreck? So maybe I get proven wrong on this one too.

All my best.

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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by Chris Brady » Fri Sep 28, 2018 11:05 am

Ares wrote:
Thu Sep 27, 2018 4:52 pm
I'm also not sure why Wonder Woman wouldn't count. Adjusted for Ticket Price Inflation, the only MCU movies that did better than her film were Avengers 1, Black Panther, Infinity War, Age of Ultron, Iron Man 3 and Captain America Civil War. Having the sales numbers of an average MCU film is a solid showing for Wonder Woman, regardless of how crap the DCEU is by comparison.
It doesn't count because even a bad meal will taste like heaven to a starving man.

Wonder Woman only made bank because of all the other crappy DCEU films before and after it. Comparing it, in terms of movie, not whether or not it made money, which it did, it's not even Ant-Man or Iron Man 3 good. But compare it to BvS? It's godly.

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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by kirinke » Sun Oct 07, 2018 12:45 pm

Having an all female cast just reeks of gimmick, instead of writing a good script and getting good actors/directors.

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Re: Rumours: People want an all Female Avengers film

Post by M4C8 » Sun Oct 07, 2018 2:30 pm

kirinke wrote:
Sun Oct 07, 2018 12:45 pm
Having an all female cast just reeks of gimmick, instead of writing a good script and getting good actors/directors.
No you don't understand, a good script and story, good actors, honouring the established lore or the wishes of existing fans no longer matters, the only thing that matters now is that the cast is diverse.


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