What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

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Batgirl III
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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by Batgirl III » Mon Jun 11, 2018 6:20 pm

bsdigitalq wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 6:05 pm
And now Johns is out too.
The Peter Principle — people in a hierarchy tend to rise to their "level of incompetence“ — strikes hard and mercilessly. Johns was a great writer and a decent editor, but he was a pretty hapless executive.
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Ares
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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by Ares » Mon Jun 11, 2018 7:07 pm

bsdigitalq wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 6:05 pm
And now Johns is out too.
Good. Maybe now we'll get the actual Captain Marvel back. Guy should have stuck to writing with a decent co-writer to balance out his weaknesses.

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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by Ken » Mon Jun 11, 2018 7:29 pm

Then there's the Didio Exception to the Peter Principal. One that allows one to flourish well beyond his level of competence.


There was a conversation I used to have with people.

Co-Worker: Ken, I know you've got seniority in our section, but now that the (insert name of low level management position) position has opened up, I want you to know I'm going to be trying for it, too. I hope that whatever happens we can still work together and get along.

Ken: Um- Yeah. It won't be a problem. Good luck to you. (I'd usually make a door opening gesture here.) I'm not going to be trying for it. I don't want it.
On curves ahead...
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That's rabbit's foot...
Didn't save the bunny...
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HalloweenJack
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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by HalloweenJack » Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:18 pm

Ares wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:35 pm
MacynSnow wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:31 pm
Ares wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 6:08 am
Part of the reason I ask is because I came across this and thought it was very well done.
What i found intresting was that,after her talk with Spidey right there,she next managed to talk THE PHOENIX into leaving the reality to permanently stay in the White Room...i love Petey Parker and his motivational speeches... :D

Me being nosey and all,what's your plan with Hope?Are you gonna star recruitment for your own game?!can i make someone for it?!.....
I'm not looking to run a game per-say. I've been dabbling with the idea of setting up a little Writing Tournament here, something that use to happen very infrequently on another board I use to go to, and where I met Jab, Kreu and HJ. It's still in the "should I give it a shot" phase, but if I decide to go with it, it'll be posted up in the The Writing Room.
.....writing tournament eh?

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Ares
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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by Ares » Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:20 pm

HalloweenJack wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:18 pm
Ares wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:35 pm
MacynSnow wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 4:31 pm


What i found intresting was that,after her talk with Spidey right there,she next managed to talk THE PHOENIX into leaving the reality to permanently stay in the White Room...i love Petey Parker and his motivational speeches... :D

Me being nosey and all,what's your plan with Hope?Are you gonna star recruitment for your own game?!can i make someone for it?!.....
I'm not looking to run a game per-say. I've been dabbling with the idea of setting up a little Writing Tournament here, something that use to happen very infrequently on another board I use to go to, and where I met Jab, Kreu and HJ. It's still in the "should I give it a shot" phase, but if I decide to go with it, it'll be posted up in the The Writing Room.
.....writing tournament eh?
I've got the itch, we've got plenty of creative types here, figure its worth throwing out there.

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HalloweenJack
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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by HalloweenJack » Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:37 pm

I might interested depending on my schedule. The monster I call "Work" takes most of my time.

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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by MacynSnow » Tue Jun 12, 2018 1:59 am

Ares wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:20 pm
HalloweenJack wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:18 pm
Ares wrote:
Sun Jun 10, 2018 8:35 pm


I'm not looking to run a game per-say. I've been dabbling with the idea of setting up a little Writing Tournament here, something that use to happen very infrequently on another board I use to go to, and where I met Jab, Kreu and HJ. It's still in the "should I give it a shot" phase, but if I decide to go with it, it'll be posted up in the The Writing Room.
.....writing tournament eh?
I've got the itch, we've got plenty of creative types here, figure its worth throwing out there.
I'd definitely be intrested.Straight Marvel/DC Brawl's or are we talking actual storyline Like Fights?


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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by MacynSnow » Tue Jun 12, 2018 4:48 am

bsdigitalq wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:29 am
I'll just leave this here...
The new Shazam title sound's intresting,but you couldn't pay me enough to read anything about the Joker....

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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by Woodclaw » Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:59 am

Batgirl III wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 6:20 pm
bsdigitalq wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 6:05 pm
And now Johns is out too.
The Peter Principle — people in a hierarchy tend to rise to their "level of incompetence“ — strikes hard and mercilessly. Johns was a great writer and a decent editor, but he was a pretty hapless executive.
I thought that was the Dilbert Principle.
"You're right. Sorry. Holy shit," I breathed, "heckhounds.”

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Batgirl III
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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by Batgirl III » Tue Jun 12, 2018 8:21 am

Woodclaw wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:59 am
I thought that was the Dilbert Principle.
Scott Adams' coined "the Dilbert Principle" to refer to the tendency of companies and governments to promote their least competent employees to management, to limit the amount of damage they are capable of doing.

In British politics, this was known as being "kicked upstairs," because if your were named to the Peerage, it disqualified you permanently from sitting in the House of Commons, where all the real decisions are made. In the military its pretty common to promote an officer and reassign them to a desk someplace, in navy jargon this is usually referred to as "being beached," since the promotion usually will remove someone from commanding a ship and leave them "on the beach."
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Ares
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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by Ares » Tue Jun 12, 2018 8:56 am

bsdigitalq wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 3:29 am
I'll just leave this here...
. . . . of course. Johns gets two new books, and one is about a villain I'm not sure he really gets, and the other is about the hero he all but ruined and definitely doesn't get. In the same year they decide to give Superman back his classic outfit, deciding that the Nu-52 changes were bad and decide to course correct.

Well, it always takes DC a little longer with Cap than Superman. Maybe by 2020 we'll have a storyline where we get the equivalent of

Image

Actually makes me wonder how they got away with the "Captain Marvel" name on the cover there.

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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by Batgirl III » Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:05 am

Image

I'm of the belief that every comic book should be written by Paul Dini and drawn by Alex Ross. Especially the idealistic, forthright paragons like Captain Marvel, Superman, and Captain America.

Other than Dini and Ross, I'd say that only Jeff Smith's Shazam!: The Monster Society of Evil (2007) seemed as close to "getting it" as anybody else in the business today.
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Ares
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Re: What's new with the big two: Marvel and DC Comics discussion thread.

Post by Ares » Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:22 am

Batgirl III wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:05 am
Image

I'm of the belief that every comic book should be written by Paul Dini and drawn by Alex Ross. Especially the idealistic, forthright paragons like Captain Marvel, Superman, and Captain America.

Other than Dini and Ross, I'd say that only Jeff Smith's Shazam!: The Monster Society of Evil (2007) seemed as close to "getting it" as anybody else in the business today.
No disagreement with Paul and Alex's book. If anything, it makes me wish that Paul Dini had been more involved with the Justice League/Unlimited story that featured Cap. I imagine Cap would have come off better.

I felt Jeff Smith's book was kind of a mixed bag, personally. The "Billy Batson and the Magic of Shazam" Johnny DC line that followed it was generally much better, IMO.

The Alex Ross/Jim Kreuger "JUSTICE!" maxi-series was another book that really got Captain Marvel right, and showcased how Cap could easily work in the DCU.

Joe Kelly did a decent job with Cap during a Superman crossover he wrote, and makes me sad that we never got to see the JLA Joe wanted with Cap on the team as a regular.

The Superman/Shazam: First Thunder mini-series showed the Judd Winick CAN write a decent classic Captain Marvel when he wants to, but I'd be hesitant to trust him again after "Trials of Shazam".

Multiversity: Thunderworld! was a decent take on the Captain and crew by Grant Morrison, even if it did show signs of current Morrison's overuse of meta-textual nonsense.

Evan "Doc" Shaner and Jeff Parker's "Convergence: Shazam" issue was basically perfect, with my only quibble being that I wish Cap had the military jacket/flap look. Other than that, given how great these two did with Future Quest, they'd be my top choice for a Captain Marvel series at this point.

And for anyone who wants a goldmine of good classic Captain Marvel stories, I'd track down the Shazam run in the old World's Finest issues, with art by Don Newton. It actually showcases a good blueprint for using Captain Marvel, and included a lot of "urban fantasy" tropes, such as Cap helping some mythological creatures like a centaur, mermaid and the like adapt to the modern world in the face of prejudice by humans, and help modern society accept them. Granted, 1970's Captain Marvel was oddly vulnerable to being transformed via lightning/electrical attacks (which never made sense to me, does that mean that a big enough jolt of electricity would turn Billy into Cap?), but apart from that, those stories were great.

There's been quite a few of decent takes on the character, they've just mostly happened outside of the mainstream DCU since 2005. But John's refusal to let the book good and let folks who really get the character take over annoys me to no end.

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