Team Cerberus (OOC)

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Flynnarrel
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by Flynnarrel » Fri Jul 06, 2018 4:04 pm

Okay, since area-burst, they'd roll dodge vs DC20 to see if full effect[10] vs. half effect[5], then would they need to roll against grapple (if armored)[STR or Dodge vs. DC20 or 15, depending on previous dodge] and then roll vs. Disarm [STR vs. DC20 or 15] for... every separate metal weapon, or once for every array, or once for every array AE that is metallic?

If they are grappled [or disarmed] is the lift a Move action?
{I've seen house rules that if the resulting movement is intended to damage then it's a Standard action (so surge or do it next round) but if it's just movement with no damage it's a move (which can be taken the same round).}
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Flynnarrel
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by Flynnarrel » Fri Jul 06, 2018 4:05 pm

kenseido wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 3:33 pm
Well if they are holding it, I would think it would be a treated as a Disarm check and if they are wearing it, then it would be treated asa grapple check against the character at a bare minimum.

In no case would it be an auto success.
And what about the gun in a holster not being held? it that a disarm as well?
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kenseido
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by kenseido » Fri Jul 06, 2018 4:35 pm

Flynnarrel wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 4:05 pm
And what about the gun in a holster not being held? it that a disarm as well?
If they are in a position to resist, they are going to try and grab the gun to keep it from flying away, the same is if it is in their hands.
Flynnarrel wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 4:04 pm
Okay, since area-burst, they'd roll dodge vs DC20 to see if full effect[10] vs. half effect[5], then would they need to roll against grapple (if armored)[STR or Dodge vs. DC20 or 15, depending on previous dodge] and then roll vs. Disarm [STR vs. DC20 or 15] for... every separate metal weapon, or once for every array, or once for every array AE that is metallic?
And I believe since it is Perception Range with Area, there is no Dodge save for half.

EpicEclipse
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by EpicEclipse » Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:05 pm

Perception range only has to do with attack rolls, wouldn't preclude the dodge check for the area effect. Subtle might catch them off guard and make them vulnerable against it, lowering their did he for the dodge check though, but I know of nothing that would completely remove their chance to reduce the rank they need to resist.

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kenseido
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by kenseido » Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:12 pm

A Perception Range Area attack in 2e did not get a Dodge save for half. Mind you, I am not talking about Perception Area, but Perception Range.

Since Perception Range targeted attacks hit regardless of Defense, it makes sense that Perception Range Area attacks would get no Dodge save to resist.

Otherwise, there is no point to making it Perception Ranged.

EpicEclipse
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by EpicEclipse » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:10 pm

The purpose is the perception range targeting mechanics of being able to place the area effect anywhere you can accurately perceive.

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kenseido
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by kenseido » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:14 pm

That is Perception Area

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Batgirl III
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by Batgirl III » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:23 pm

Area (Perception): The effect works on anyone able to perceive the target point with a particular sense, chosen when you apply this extra, like a Sense-Dependent effect (see the Sense-Dependent modifier). Targets get a Dodge resistance check, as usual, but if the check is successful suffer no effect (rather than half).

A perception area ranged effect can be placed anywhere the user can accurately perceive. Perception area effects neither require an attack check nor allow a Dodge resistance check, although targets still get a normal resistance check against the effect. perception area effects are blocked by either concealment or cover; choose one when acquiring the effect.

Range (Perception): The effect works on any target you can perceive with an accurate sense, without any need for an attack check. If you cannot accurately perceive the target, you cannot affect it.
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EpicEclipse
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by EpicEclipse » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:41 pm

Huh.... excuse me. Let me just get my foot out of my mouth real quick.

That makes them really powerful... slap selective on ranged and area (+3 to the base cost) and you have an aoe that can hit multiple foes at full rank with no attack roll. Based on the wording, it doesn't need to be perception range even. "Perception area ranged effect", not "Perception area and ranged" as you would expect.

Weird. :/

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kenseido
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by kenseido » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:47 pm

I know what the book says, I know what the many rule interpretations were in 2e. Adding Range Perception to an Area attack meant no Reflex savein 2e.

And yes, a Selective Area attack of any kind is ridiculously powerful.

MacynSnow
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by MacynSnow » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:48 pm

EpicEclipse wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:41 pm
Huh.... excuse me. Let me just get my foot out of my mouth real quick.

That makes them really powerful... slap selective on ranged and area (+3 to the base cost) and you have an aoe that can hit multiple foes at full rank with no attack roll. Based on the wording, it doesn't need to be perception range even. "Perception area ranged effect", not "Perception area and ranged" as you would expect.

Weird. :/
I've noticed that as well in the Entire M&M system(it appears more obviously in 3e,but is just as prevailant(?) in 2e.).If your not carefull with how you write a power out,you don't even get to have a roll(on either side of the Screen)....
Last edited by MacynSnow on Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:12 am, edited 1 time in total.

EpicEclipse
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by EpicEclipse » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:52 pm

kenseido wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:47 pm
I know what the book says, I know what the many rule interpretations were in 2e. Adding Range Perception to an Area attack meant no Reflex savein 2e.

And yes, a Selective Area attack of any kind is ridiculously powerful.
I think Batgirl posted that for me to be corrected. I was the mistaken one in the exchange.

Though in this case it seems to be the other way around, adding ranged to a perception area, rather than area to perception range. (I'm gonna dig my book out to double check that it's not actually both ways)

But yeah, selective is already really powerful, but then removing the dodge check for half rank on top of that is crazy.

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kenseido
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by kenseido » Fri Jul 06, 2018 11:32 pm

I apologize if my comments came of as rude or out of place. It's not an excuse by any means, but I was responding on my phone and was having trouble with who was saying what.

I will do better to track the discussion better in the future.

EpicEclipse
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by EpicEclipse » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:19 am

kenseido wrote:
Fri Jul 06, 2018 11:32 pm
I apologize if my comments came of as rude or out of place. It's not an excuse by any means, but I was responding on my phone and was having trouble with who was saying what.

I will do better to track the discussion better in the future.
No offence taken man. S'all good in the hood! I was the one with my foot in my mouth. :P

Flynnarrel
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Re: Team Cerberus (OOC)

Post by Flynnarrel » Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:57 am

Was not my intention to make an OP character. Much of her build comes from a Magenta (Flash Villain) build in the character sheets section, I didn't even think how that particular power would play out. I can change it, T-man, to make it more playable/balanced, open to suggestions.
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