Jab’s Builds! (Lawnmower Man! Samus Aran! Metroids!)

Where in all of your character write ups will go.
User avatar
Ares
Site Admin
Posts: 4964
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:40 am

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Ares »

Batgirl III wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 6:52 am Karate Kid versus Cassandra Cain. Someone make this happen.
Image
Woodclaw wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:50 am Shang Chi as referee.
Image

Seriously, that website has Val fighting EVERYONE. Including Optimus Prime, Fin Fang Foom, and Galactus.

Though one fight I WOULD like to see?

Image

Not only would both of them view it as a fun battle, but Val would really relish the challenge. "FINALLY, one of you superstrong types who actually knows how to fight!"
"My heart is as light as a child's, a feeling I'd nearly forgotten. And by helping those in need, I will be able to keep that feeling alive."
- Captain Marvel SHAZAM! : Power of Hope (2000)

Want to support me and Echoes of the Multiverse? Follow this link to subscribe or donate.
User avatar
Batgirl III
Posts: 3626
Joined: Tue Nov 08, 2016 6:17 am
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Batgirl III »

The oddest design decision in DCA (and I suspect this was a DC mandate and not Green Ronin’s idea) was that all the characters are based on their status during that odd few months Post-Infinite Crisis but Pre-Flashpoint. Hence things like Roy Harper having no bow!
BARON wrote:I'm talking batgirl with batgirl. I love you internet.
User avatar
Ares
Site Admin
Posts: 4964
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:40 am

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Ares »

Batgirl III wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:42 pm The oddest design decision in DCA (and I suspect this was a DC mandate and not Green Ronin’s idea) was that all the characters are based on their status during that odd few months Post-Infinite Crisis but Pre-Flashpoint. Hence things like Roy Harper having no bow!
It seemed like it was a mix of portrayals, in many cases trying for a "Best Of" approach while some choices seemed to be limited by editorial mandate. For instance, the Marvel Family are all pretty much given their classic portrayals during a time when Billy was "Marvel the White", Freddy was "Shazam" and Mary was "Black Mary Marvel" . . . and I'm VERY grateful for GR going the classic route over the then-current route. Plus it was nice to have a DC Heroes RPG that FINALLY gave Cap and Supes equal physical stats.

One of the weirder bits was that they apparently had some kind of issue calling the "Mad Hatter" by his supervillain name, even though the Mad Hatter name was nowhere near the cover of the book and it's very clear this character is distinct from the Lewis Carol character. So they actually have to list him by his real name.
"My heart is as light as a child's, a feeling I'd nearly forgotten. And by helping those in need, I will be able to keep that feeling alive."
- Captain Marvel SHAZAM! : Power of Hope (2000)

Want to support me and Echoes of the Multiverse? Follow this link to subscribe or donate.
User avatar
Ken
Posts: 3461
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 10:40 pm
Location: Sycalb, Madiganistan

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Ken »

Ares wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:48 pm
Batgirl III wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:42 pm The oddest design decision in DCA (and I suspect this was a DC mandate and not Green Ronin’s idea) was that all the characters are based on their status during that odd few months Post-Infinite Crisis but Pre-Flashpoint. Hence things like Roy Harper having no bow!
It seemed like it was a mix of portrayals, in many cases trying for a "Best Of" approach while some choices seemed to be limited by editorial mandate. For instance, the Marvel Family are all pretty much given their classic portrayals during a time when Billy was "Marvel the White", Freddy was "Shazam" and Mary was "Black Mary Marvel" . . . and I'm VERY grateful for GR going the classic route over the then-current route. Plus it was nice to have a DC Heroes RPG that FINALLY gave Cap and Supes equal physical stats.

One of the weirder bits was that they apparently had some kind of issue calling the "Mad Hatter" by his supervillain name, even though the Mad Hatter name was nowhere near the cover of the book and it's very clear this character is distinct from the Lewis Carol character. So they actually have to list him by his real name.
What about the fact that Tim Drake actually has two separate entries, one as Red Robin (part of the the characters are based on their status during that odd few months Post-Infinite Crisis but Pre-Flashpoint) and one as Robin (the "Best Of" approach)?

I also found the STR scores on the Blackhawks peculiarly high for a bunch of pilots.
My Amazing Woman: a super-hero romantic comedy podcast.

When the most powerful super hero on Earth marries an ordinary man, hilarity ensues.
greycrusader
Posts: 1184
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 11:25 pm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by greycrusader »

Ares wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:48 pm
Batgirl III wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:42 pm The oddest design decision in DCA (and I suspect this was a DC mandate and not Green Ronin’s idea) was that all the characters are based on their status during that odd few months Post-Infinite Crisis but Pre-Flashpoint. Hence things like Roy Harper having no bow!
It seemed like it was a mix of portrayals, in many cases trying for a "Best Of" approach while some choices seemed to be limited by editorial mandate. For instance, the Marvel Family are all pretty much given their classic portrayals during a time when Billy was "Marvel the White", Freddy was "Shazam" and Mary was "Black Mary Marvel" . . . and I'm VERY grateful for GR going the classic route over the then-current route. Plus it was nice to have a DC Heroes RPG that FINALLY gave Cap and Supes equal physical stats.

One of the weirder bits was that they apparently had some kind of issue calling the "Mad Hatter" by his supervillain name, even though the Mad Hatter name was nowhere near the cover of the book and it's very clear this character is distinct from the Lewis Carol character. So they actually have to list him by his real name.
Please remember, GR-and all the freelancers like me who worked on the project-had to follow the lead of DC editorial. Which change twice over during the course of the volumes. I actually had a PM conversation with Jab about this, and how it may have been affected by the "heat" DC was under from WB regarding sales figures at the time. In hindsight, I'm very glad I got to work on a number of more minor characters, who weren't under as much scrutiny. Though sad that for legal reasons, my write-ups of Icon, Rocket,and Hardware got cut at the last minute.

(Wonder what YJ will do in syndication with all the times Icon and Rocket figured into the episodes?)

All my best.
User avatar
Batgirl III
Posts: 3626
Joined: Tue Nov 08, 2016 6:17 am
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Batgirl III »

I also found the STR scores on the Blackhawks peculiarly high for a bunch of pilots.
This is a particular quirk of the M&M system, human level stats are all kind of “compressed” in the 0-4 range. This is most easily quantities with Strength. A STR 4 actually makes you stronger than the Olympic Weightlifting record holder and anyone with a +10 or better Athletics Skill can outrun Usain Bolt.

Still, for a system to be easily handle everyone from Black Adam to Victor Zasza? I’ll take it.
BARON wrote:I'm talking batgirl with batgirl. I love you internet.
User avatar
Woodclaw
Posts: 1462
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:05 pm
Location: Como, Italy

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Woodclaw »

Ares wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:48 pm
Batgirl III wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:42 pm The oddest design decision in DCA (and I suspect this was a DC mandate and not Green Ronin’s idea) was that all the characters are based on their status during that odd few months Post-Infinite Crisis but Pre-Flashpoint. Hence things like Roy Harper having no bow!
It seemed like it was a mix of portrayals, in many cases trying for a "Best Of" approach while some choices seemed to be limited by editorial mandate. For instance, the Marvel Family are all pretty much given their classic portrayals during a time when Billy was "Marvel the White", Freddy was "Shazam" and Mary was "Black Mary Marvel" . . . and I'm VERY grateful for GR going the classic route over the then-current route. Plus it was nice to have a DC Heroes RPG that FINALLY gave Cap and Supes equal physical stats.

One of the weirder bits was that they apparently had some kind of issue calling the "Mad Hatter" by his supervillain name, even though the Mad Hatter name was nowhere near the cover of the book and it's very clear this character is distinct from the Lewis Carol character. So they actually have to list him by his real name.
From what I remember the problem was threefold:
  1. DC gave GR an unreasonable time-frame forcing the development team to call the reinforcements (i.e. some of our old buddies from the ATT), but this lead to a number of inconsistent builds since everyone had a different power scale in mind;
  2. DC was keeping the entire New-52 initiative under wraps and decided not to divulge anything even to companies handling their licenses;
  3. The workload was so enormous that nobody was able to check all the build, leading to a lot of minor discrepancies becoming bigger and bigger as the stuff was passed to the printer.
"You're right. Sorry. Holy shit," I breathed, "heckhounds.”

WareHouse W (main build thread for M&M)
User avatar
Ares
Site Admin
Posts: 4964
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:40 am

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Ares »

Woodclaw wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 4:45 pm
Ares wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:48 pm
Batgirl III wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:42 pm The oddest design decision in DCA (and I suspect this was a DC mandate and not Green Ronin’s idea) was that all the characters are based on their status during that odd few months Post-Infinite Crisis but Pre-Flashpoint. Hence things like Roy Harper having no bow!
It seemed like it was a mix of portrayals, in many cases trying for a "Best Of" approach while some choices seemed to be limited by editorial mandate. For instance, the Marvel Family are all pretty much given their classic portrayals during a time when Billy was "Marvel the White", Freddy was "Shazam" and Mary was "Black Mary Marvel" . . . and I'm VERY grateful for GR going the classic route over the then-current route. Plus it was nice to have a DC Heroes RPG that FINALLY gave Cap and Supes equal physical stats.

One of the weirder bits was that they apparently had some kind of issue calling the "Mad Hatter" by his supervillain name, even though the Mad Hatter name was nowhere near the cover of the book and it's very clear this character is distinct from the Lewis Carol character. So they actually have to list him by his real name.
From what I remember the problem was threefold:
  1. DC gave GR an unreasonable time-frame forcing the development team to call the reinforcements (i.e. some of our old buddies from the ATT), but this lead to a number of inconsistent builds since everyone had a different power scale in mind;
  2. DC was keeping the entire New-52 initiative under wraps and decided not to divulge anything even to companies handling their licenses;
  3. The workload was so enormous that nobody was able to check all the build, leading to a lot of minor discrepancies becoming bigger and bigger as the stuff was passed to the printer.
Jeez, that sounds like a mess. Still, I'm glad we got the Pre-Flashpoint versions of the character rather than Nu-52 versions immediately following Flashpoint. THAT would have sucked.

Though from what I understand, DC kept the idea of Flashpoint being a reboot a secret from many of their own writers, as the decision was somewhat of a last minute one with the idea of "fuck it, lets just start over, throw stuff at the wall and see what works".
"My heart is as light as a child's, a feeling I'd nearly forgotten. And by helping those in need, I will be able to keep that feeling alive."
- Captain Marvel SHAZAM! : Power of Hope (2000)

Want to support me and Echoes of the Multiverse? Follow this link to subscribe or donate.
User avatar
Batgirl III
Posts: 3626
Joined: Tue Nov 08, 2016 6:17 am
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Batgirl III »

There were also certain creative teams (read: Morrison, Grant) that absolutely refused to let The New 52 actually reboot the work they had done previously. This led to the Batman Family books of the era being hilariously bad mismatch with some of them being wholly onboard with The New 52 (e.g., Batgirl), others carrying on as if nothing had changed at all (e.g., Batman), and some having to try to thread the needle of being both (e.g., Detective Comics).

It worked if you only read one or two of the titles. If you tried to read them all, you suddenly saw all the cracks in the Fourth Wall. Like, how the hell did Bruce go through five Robins in under ten years!? How had Barbara known Dick as Batgirl and Robin, if she’d been paralyzed for a decade... which would have been when she was a teenager, since she was now a college undergrad, but she’d been Batgirl. Apparently before the Batman was the Batman!? How was Maggie Sawyer the Metropolis cop who used to work with Superman if she’d lived in Gotham longer than Superman had been active!?

I could go on about this for YEARS.
BARON wrote:I'm talking batgirl with batgirl. I love you internet.
User avatar
Ares
Site Admin
Posts: 4964
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:40 am

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Ares »

Batgirl III wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:14 pm There were also certain creative teams (read: Morrison, Grant) that absolutely refused to let The New 52 actually reboot the work they had done previously. This led to the Batman Family books of the era being hilariously bad mismatch with some of them being wholly onboard with The New 52 (e.g., Batgirl), others carrying on as if nothing had changed at all (e.g., Batman), and some having to try to thread the needle of being both (e.g., Detective Comics).

It worked if you only read one or two of the titles. If you tried to read them all, you suddenly saw all the cracks in the Fourth Wall. Like, how the hell did Bruce go through five Robins in under ten years!? How had Barbara known Dick as Batgirl and Robin, if she’d been paralyzed for a decade... which would have been when she was a teenager, since she was now a college undergrad, but she’d been Batgirl. Apparently before the Batman was the Batman!? How was Maggie Sawyer the Metropolis cop who used to work with Superman if she’d lived in Gotham longer than Superman had been active!?

I could go on about this for YEARS.
For all the continuity problems the original Crisis on Infinite Earths caused (and they were many), the Nu-52 makes the Post-Crisis Universe look like the Marvel Cinematic Universe. Though in that analogy, if the Pre-Flashpoint DCU is the MCU, then everything after Flaspoint is the DCEU.
"My heart is as light as a child's, a feeling I'd nearly forgotten. And by helping those in need, I will be able to keep that feeling alive."
- Captain Marvel SHAZAM! : Power of Hope (2000)

Want to support me and Echoes of the Multiverse? Follow this link to subscribe or donate.
User avatar
Batgirl III
Posts: 3626
Joined: Tue Nov 08, 2016 6:17 am
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Batgirl III »

The DCU was at its best, IMHO, Post-Zero Hour and Pre-Flashpoint.

I can appreciate the desire of editorial to want to avoid “continuity lockout,” but honestly, in an era of ubiquitous internet access: with Google, Wikipedia and fan-made Wikis, and digital back issues... I think DC and Marvel both should embrace having long and complex histories. Instead of the old school practice of an Asterisk telling readers to “See Issue #20 –Ed.” they should embed a QR code with a link to an official Wiki page, with plenty of advertising links to their digital back catalogue.

Don’t ignore The Great Darkness Saga, don’t just say something happened in some issue #whatever: link to a summary and then sell the reader a copy!
BARON wrote:I'm talking batgirl with batgirl. I love you internet.
Spectrum
Posts: 3138
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:08 pm

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Spectrum »

Nifty idea. Just curious, any idea how small you can make a QR code and still have it readable and not prone to printing errors?
We rise from the ashes so that new legends can be born.
Jabroniville
Posts: 24808
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 8:05 pm

Sensor

Post by Jabroniville »

Image
Image
Image

SENSOR (Jeka Wynzorr)
Created By:
Roger Stern, Tom McCraw & Jeffrey Moy
First Appearance: Legionnaires #43 (Dec. 1996)
Home Planet: Orando
Origin of Powers: Inherited
Eras: Reboot Only
Relationships: Chameleon Boy (Reboot flirtation)
Role: Illusionist, Fandom-Enraging Character
PL 10 (138)
STRENGTH
1 STAMINA 2 AGILITY 3
FIGHTING 7 DEXTERITY 2
INTELLIGENCE 0 AWARENESS 2 PRESENCE 3

Skills:
Deception 5 (+8)
Expertise (Royalty) 6 (+6)
Expertise (Space Hero) 2 (+2)
Insight 1 (+3)
Perception 4 (+8)
Persuasion 2 (+5)
Stealth 4 (+7)

Advantages:
Benefit (Princess of Orando), Daze (Deception), Defensive Roll, Equipment 10 (Legion Gear), Fascinate (Deception), Set-Up, Teamwork

Powers:
Illusion 10 (All Sense Types) (50) -- [51]
  • AE: "Fearsome Images" Affliction 10 (Will; Dazed/Stunned/Paralyzed) (Extras: Sustained +2, Cumulative, Area- Visual Perception) (Flaws: Instant Recovery) (40)
"Snake Senses" Senses 2 (Infravision, Acute Scent) [2]
"Snake Movement" Movement 1 (Slithering) [2]

Equipment:
"Legion Gear"
"Telepathic Ear Plug" Comprehend 3 (Languages) (6)

"Legion Flight Ring"
Flight 7 (250 mph) (14)
Immunity 7 (Hot, Cold, Vacuum, Pressure, Radiation, Suffocation 2) (7)
Movement 1 (Space Travel 1) (2)
Communication 5 (Flaws: Fifth Rank is only towards Legionnaires) (18)

Offense:
Unarmed +8 (+1 Damage, DC 16)
Fearsome Images +10 Area (+10 Affliction, DC 20)
Illusion +10 (+10 Illusion, DC 20)
Initiative +3

Defenses:
Dodge +10 (DC 20), Parry +9 (DC 19), Toughness +2 (+3 D.Roll), Fortitude +4, Will +6

Complications:
Responsibility (Orando)- As a Princess, then Queen, of Orando, Jeka has many responsibilities.
Disabled (Armless)- Without a goofy-looking pair of cybernetic limbs, Jeka cannot easily manipulate objects.

Total: Abilities: 40 / Skills: 24--12 / Advantages: 16 / Powers: 55 / Defenses: 15 (138)

Reboot-Era Sensor:
-In the post-Zero Hour "hey, crazy idea: let's have some non-humanoids!" period (and why not? The GL Corps have had non-humanoids for decades, and the LOSH was in the even WEIRDER future, yet everyone was blue or purple Star Trek-style aliens), she got turned into a snake with the same powers. This was REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAALLLLY controversial with fans of the hot platinum blonde chick. She wore a pair of cybernetic arms, and renounced her heritage as Princess of Orando to travel the stars. A bolt of "Hypertaxis" energy blasted her, and Ra's al Ghul transformed her into a humanoid anthro/snake thing. She remained in this form until the continuity rebooted itself.

-Here, she has the same general powers as did Jeckie, but also some snake stuff.
Last edited by Jabroniville on Wed May 25, 2022 11:39 am, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Batgirl III
Posts: 3626
Joined: Tue Nov 08, 2016 6:17 am
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Batgirl III »

Spectrum wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 6:30 pm Nifty idea. Just curious, any idea how small you can make a QR code and still have it readable and not prone to printing errors?
Not my area of expertise, but some quick googling tells me that the answer is that favorite of lawyers world wide It Depends. Basically, you have to account for how much data you want it to include and how close or far the scanning camera will be from the QR code.

Since I’m invisioning just a basic URL to a Wikipedia-type page and a comic book in someone’s lap can be easily made quite close to that person’s phone... I’d reckon you could get something around 5-10 mm square. Probably even smaller. But that’s about the same area as the typical “See Issue #20 –Ed.” box we’ve all been seeing since the Sixties.
BARON wrote:I'm talking batgirl with batgirl. I love you internet.
User avatar
Batgirl III
Posts: 3626
Joined: Tue Nov 08, 2016 6:17 am
Location: Portland, Oregon

Re: Jab's Builds! (Timber Wolf! Cosmic Boy! Kid Quantum! Karate Kid!

Post by Batgirl III »

I always appreciated that the writers had Jeka’s reaction to her transformation into a humanoid-snake hybrid form to be one of absolute horror and shock.

Hack writers would have had the giant snake who turned into a hot pink humanoid get over it too easy. But Jeka treated it with the same level of abject terror most writers would have had a human who got transformed react with. After all, from her point of view, it was a hideous deformation of her natural body.
BARON wrote:I'm talking batgirl with batgirl. I love you internet.
Post Reply