Ken's Kache of Khracters (Star Knights; Lumpy; Psibertron; Ronin)

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Jabroniville
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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Jabroniville » Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:15 pm

Haha, THESE guys! The most infamous of the SuperFriends, and the eternal warning against Token-ism. Apache Chief is probably most infamous, since he's the silliest looking and most stereotypical. Black Vulcan is just a GREAT example of corporate sleaze ("Oh, we have to pay Isabella?... Well, let's just file the serial numbers off and change his last name."), but the other two are pretty forgettable nobodies. Did they even show up very often? I know the show was bad for just introducing random powers without explanation for some of these guys (Time Travel or something?).

But really, these guys are probably more infamous for SeanBaby's website, in the early days of "Comedy Websites". He just ENDLESSLY riffed on SuperFriends.

Great to see you back and posting, by the way :).

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by catsi563 » Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:22 pm

Do love though how JLU paid both tribute to them and even better UPDATED all of them into actual cool characters.

Even the bloody wonder twins were made cool :D
Dr. Silverback has wryly observed that this is like trying to teach lolcats about Shakespeare

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Ken » Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:40 pm

catsi563 wrote:
Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:22 pm
Do love though how JLU paid both tribute to them and even better UPDATED all of them into actual cool characters.

Even the bloody wonder twins were made cool :D
Wind Dragon and Long Shadow (Samurai and Apache Chief) were cool. Juice actually got less characterisation than Black Vulcan. And Dounpour and Shifter had better codenames (they had codenames), but they weren't any cooler than Zan and Jayna.

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Ken » Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:41 pm

Which of these actresses never played a heroine who was a member of the Super Friends?

a) Lynda Carter
b) Audrey Hepburn
c) Yvonne Craig
d) Ciara Renée

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Ken » Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:54 pm

Jabroniville wrote:
Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:15 pm
the other two are pretty forgettable nobodies. Did they even show up very often? I know the show was bad for just introducing random powers without explanation for some of these guys (Time Travel or something?).

But really, these guys are probably more infamous for SeanBaby's website, in the early days of "Comedy Websites". He just ENDLESSLY riffed on SuperFriends.

Great to see you back and posting, by the way :).
Samurai got about the same amount of screen time as Apache Chief and Black Vulcan. They each had two appearances on the "All-New SuperFriends". And all three were regulars (along with Flash, GL and Hawkman, and the big 5) during "Challenge of the Super Friends". From 1980-82, HB was doing the SuperFriends solely as 7-12 minute shorts. All three were used semi-regularly there. The 81-82 season was when El Dorado was added.

It was Black Vulcan who got random time travel powers.

The 82-83 season never aired in the U.S. when I was watching, so I can't comment on those. All 4 got some push the year Firestorm was added. The next (final) year, they added Cyborg, and Black Vulcan was a no show. It was if Cyborg filled the Super Powers Team (as they were called then) quota of black heroes, so Black Vulcan had to go. I think it sent the wrong message.

The SeanBaby thing, maybe for people below a certain age. I grew up with the SuperFriends. I mean the first ones were on when I started Kindergarten and the last ones were on during my senior year of high school. I really did grow up with them. And during the early days of the Internet, I was at a job without Internet access most of the time.

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Jabroniville » Fri Jun 23, 2017 9:20 am

Ken wrote:
Thu Jun 22, 2017 8:54 pm
Samurai got about the same amount of screen time as Apache Chief and Black Vulcan. They each had two appearances on the "All-New SuperFriends". And all three were regulars (along with Flash, GL and Hawkman, and the big 5) during "Challenge of the Super Friends". From 1980-82, HB was doing the SuperFriends solely as 7-12 minute shorts. All three were used semi-regularly there. The 81-82 season was when El Dorado was added.
Ah, that's interesting. I only watched a handful of episodes, and never saw El Dorado show up.
The SeanBaby thing, maybe for people below a certain age. I grew up with the SuperFriends. I mean the first ones were on when I started Kindergarten and the last ones were on during my senior year of high school. I really did grow up with them. And during the early days of the Internet, I was at a job without Internet access most of the time.
I didn't realize that the show had lasted so long- kindergarten to high school? Wow.

It makes me wonder what it was like growing up in a world where you could watch such things without irony or sarcasm tainting your viewpoint, and seeing them as authentic shows. Reminds me of how I didn't realize that The Princess Bride and Batman (1960s West version :() were supposed to be FUNNY- I took them as straight dramas with some humor!
The 82-83 season never aired in the U.S. when I was watching, so I can't comment on those. All 4 got some push the year Firestorm was added. The next (final) year, they added Cyborg, and Black Vulcan was a no show. It was if Cyborg filled the Super Powers Team (as they were called then) quota of black heroes, so Black Vulcan had to go. I think it sent the wrong message.
Hah! Indeed. It's always funny how "let's be inclusive/add in minorities!" is so often tainted with "But we just need the one". Wolfman & Perez, working on their Teen Titans revamp in the '80s, actually considered making Starfire "a black" (it says in the notes), due to the inherent uniqueness in them having the only team with TWO black people on it!


But man... SeanBaby's site. I remember laughing at those things CONSTANTLY, as he'd re-edit the images to contain them making fun of Aquaman (who was apparently a wimp in the show). This was possibly my first encounter with this type of sarcastic, ironic humor on the internet- this or X-Entertainment. Stuff that delved into the realm of nostalgia, but always pointed out how silly things often were. You, uh... might see that reflected in my own writing :).

SeanBaby's thoughts on Samurai: http://www.seanbaby.com/superfriends/samurai.htm

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Ken » Fri Jun 23, 2017 11:58 am

Jabroniville wrote:
Fri Jun 23, 2017 9:20 am
The SeanBaby thing, maybe for people below a certain age. I grew up with the SuperFriends. I mean the first ones were on when I started Kindergarten and the last ones were on during my senior year of high school. I really did grow up with them. And during the early days of the Internet, I was at a job without Internet access most of the time.
I didn't realize that the show had lasted so long- kindergarten to high school? Wow.

It makes me wonder what it was like growing up in a world where you could watch such things without irony or sarcasm tainting your viewpoint, and seeing them as authentic shows. Reminds me of how I didn't realize that The Princess Bride and Batman (1960s West version :() were supposed to be FUNNY- I took them as straight dramas with some humor!

Well, in the case of Batman that was how it was supposed to be. The creators wanted it to be a show where children saw an adventure show, and where the adults saw comedy. One of the reasons the show ended as quickly as it did is that the writers lost sight of that. Over time, the comedy became more juvenile, so the kids could see it, and at the same time, as the humour became more juvenile, it became less funny to the adults. It went from being a family show to a kids show.

I'm pretty sure The Princess Bride may have been intended the same way, but since I was 19 when it came out (yes, I'm one of the 73 people who saw it first run), I was in on the humour from the get go.

And if you check the "Credits" page on SeanBaby's site, it says "The shitty one with Marvin, Wendy, and Wonder Dog. 1973-74" AND "The season with Cyborg, Darkseid, and naked robot Brainiac, where they let belly-hanging TV joke, Adam West, take over doing Batman's voice. 1985-86" That's thirteen years. Not every year had new episodes; after 1974 their were no new episodes until 1977. But those first 16 episodes, the ones SeanBaby describes as "shitty", stayed on Saturday Morning all that time, and kept getting good ratings! That's why ABC (the American network) and HB decided that there should be more made.

Aquaman was a weird case. In the earliest episodes (the "shitty" ones) Aquaman's tremendous strength was on display. He was shown lifting and swimming while carrying cubic metre blocks of concrete and boulders, and he helped a pair of whales manually steer an out of control submarine. There was even an early Zan & Jayna episode where he bent the steel bars of a cell with ease. But, this was US kids TV in the 1970s. All the violence was sanitised. For, 13 years and neither Batman nor Robin threw a punch. But because Batman was in syndication, no one forgot that they were melee combatants. Eventually, the SF writers got lazy, and just showed Aquaman using his marine telepathy. And then they gave him the Aqua-scooter; that's like giving the Flash a car. So, yeah, Aquaman ended up a wimp, but it took them a while to get there.

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Re: Apache Chief

Post by Goldar » Fri Jun 23, 2017 5:26 pm

Ken wrote:
Thu Jun 22, 2017 6:04 pm
ImageImage

Apache Chief - PL 10

In his early appearances, the narrator said Apache Chief grew to be 50 ft. tall. The animators weren't so careful. In the opening sequences some years we saw him standing at skyscraper height or tall enough to hold up both ends of a train trestle.
Hey there Pal!

Glad to see you back and posting again! And The Superfriends are a good start. I am enjoying all of the characters.

Now as to the height thing, us 50-Foot Folk have got to stick together. I think it is the camera lens making it appear that we are taller or smaller. :P

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Jabroniville » Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:54 am

It's hard for me to watch SuperFriends and not make fun, because I only saw it as an adult, and after it'd struck Meme-status for its silliness. Watching Zan & Jayna form stuff like "ice tricycles" and "ice stilts" (which they tried to use to walk through LAVA!) are why people make fun of that show to this day.

I only saw one episode with Firestorm, but it was pretty funny the way he was treated like a dumb rookie. He complimented Wonder Woman's looks, which just pissed her off- Professor Stein was like "You should have known better, Ronald...".

What's funny is that the cartoon has probably done more to damage Aquaman's real-world reputation than anything else. He was probably sort of known before that, but the cartoon seems to be what cemented him as the "Joke Superhero"- the Night Boat of superheroes.

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Champions of Justice vs the WorldFriends

Post by Ken » Thu Jul 06, 2017 5:28 pm

Recap of the Champions of Justice story (DCA/M&M) run on Sunday, 2 July, 2017, at Neil's house:

It was the Thursday night, a week before Thanksgiving (U.S.), and several Champions of Justice, and convened in the private room of the Pitcher's Mound, in Seattle, for socializing. Running Stag (Longbow) Johnson, Billie (Harrier) Brosnan, Charlotte (la Chatte Noire III) Breié, Gary (Osprey) Grant, Linda (Ampere) Carlson, and Dr. Doyle (Megaman) Conan were there as three couples. Marc (Backlash) Adams, Valerie (Charcoal) Roberts, John (Shockwave) Johnson, Kenny (Colonel Victory) Douglas joined them, as did Music Man and Taran (both in their heroic identities). Scott (Powerball) Montoya, the owner of the Pitcher's Mound, allowed himself some down time to join them.

Scott had been thinking about going public with his double identity, and he wanted to discuss it with his colleagues. Stag talked about how his secret protected his family and his tribe, Kenny talked about the hassles of he endured, being declared missing in his civilian identity when his heroic identity publicly died, and then sorting it out upon his return to life. Valerie and the cousins, Billie and Gary, discussed how keeping secret identities were part of their families' birthrights, and Charlotte shared the hassles of having that birthright lost. Music Man mostly provided mood music.

Taran had little to add on the secret identity discussion, as kegs of mead kept being dropped off by Turbo, who was in and out, repeatedly. On one stop in he shared how he pretty much was Turbo most of the time, while his wife worked (and sometimes feels guilty about not using her powers). Marc talked about some of the problems he faced with the ways newspapers handle comic strips, and found out that Stag was a longtime fan of Marc's "Li'l Gambit" strip, but hadn't realized that his heroic colleague Backlash was "That Marc Adams".

The discussion could have probably gone on all night, except their waitress Cindy (Firefly) Miller, interrupted them to turn on a news broadcast about impeached U.S. President Andrew Mahn being allowed to appear in person (despite un-proven rumors of him secretly being a parahuman) at the appeal of some of the criminal charges in Denver the next day. Several of the Champions decided they ought to be on-hand or nearby, in case Masked Marvel, the Lynch Mob, the Rainbow Warriors, or any of Mahn's other allies, tried anything to free their one-time benefactor.

------------------

The following day, Ampere, Colonel Victory, and Music Man were publicly waiting right outside the United States Court of Appeals for the Tenth Circuit, in Denver, Colorado. Denver was the home of the central office for MahnTech and had been Mahn's primary residence before winning the Presidency. Valerie Roberts and Marc Adams were waiting at a nearby café. Turbo was patrolling the city at invisible speed, and Taran was hanging out outside Sports Authority Field at Mile High. Members of the Denver office of Strike Force, as well as Strike Force's mobile team (and their flying Blue Tank) were all on hand, as well, Andrew Mahn and his lawyer arrived in a stretch Hyperion.

When a giagantic flying figure was spotted flying in from the southeast, Taran was dispatched to investigate. And once the heroes turned their attention skyward, seven more figures were spotted coming in from the northwest. Turbo, Backlash and Charcoal had joined their colleagues by the time the septet arrived outside the Tenth Circuit office. Xam Xian the Olympian led the group, and he told Mahn that he was about to pay for his crimes. Realizing that the Olympian intended to kill Mahn, Turbo immediately moved Mahn to inside the heavily armored Blue Tank.

Olympian's one recognised ally was the blue-skinned Tritan, Olympian's fellow exiled Erylusian. The other five were unknowns. They included an African-American electricity wielder (Watts), a Japanese man (Shizoku), a native American in a uniform based on native dress (Comanche Chief), a cloaked, shirtless Mexican sorcerer (Río Bravo), and a college aged guy with a glowing orange cone on top of his head (Stormfire). The Champions realized Nimrod's "Friends of the World" had picked up some more (ethnic) members, perhaps because Marathon, Nimrod and Asshur were hopefully still incarcerated.

Ampere moved to a defensive position above the Blue Tank, as Turbo used his speed to create a disabling vortex around the WorldFriends. This was countered as Turbo discovered that Shizoku a wind controller who dispersed the wind attack. Comanche Chief called out "tuhmubitai", the Comanche word for "black walnut tree", and grew to a tree-like size, and the battle began in earnest. Backlash redirected Watts electric burst. Turbo found himself the target of an almost sneak attack by Revenger the Living Weapon (former Havok member; Lynch Mob member; an Mahn stooge) but spotted him in time to avoid the attack. And Comanche Chief and the Music Mans entered melee. Charcoal tried, vainly, to attack Olympian.

Elsewhere, above the city, Taran found himself confronting the dark grey form of a mech-like battle suit, and its Tanzanian pilot. Taran didn't know that his foe was known as Hatari Man (or translating from Swahili "Danger Man"). Taran brought Hatari Man down to ground level, but was having difficulty damaging the large battle suit. Then again, Hatari Man wasn't damaging Taran either.

Ampere realised that Río Bravo had magicaly teleported inside the Blue Tank, and was considering options when Olympian lifted the entire tank and hurled it through the air. Only Colonel Victory intercepting it kept it from crashing outside the city. And Stormfire phased into the tank as well.

District Chief Glass, and Walt Wilcox's Mobile Specialized Team were moving civilians out of harms way that left Turbo free to duke it out with the Living Weapon. Ampere entered the Tank, herself, to protect Mahn, only to be cursed at by a super-charged Mahn who was dealing with his WorldFriend attackers violently and effectively. Backlash began wrestling with Tritan for his trident, and Tritan couldn't shake Backlash free, and when the other WorldFriends tried to help, it just made Backlash more powerful. Music Man's three selves quickly overwhelmed Comanche Chief.

Frustrated, Taran whirled his hammer to create a spatial portal and removed Hatari Man into space. He then left for the court building to join the battle there.

Colonel Victory enter the Tank as Ampere left it (but she used her ability to sense neural electricity to keep track of what was happening). Mahn had defeated the WorldFriend pair, and it fell to Colonel Victory to keep him from killing them.

Shizouku's whirlwind attacks had knocked out one of the three Music Men, but the remaining pair were joined by Charcoal in fighting him. Turbo finally beat Revenger, but was frustrated at how long it took, and he went to take that frustration out on Watts. And Olympian continued to try to beat Backlash into releasing Tritan's "swork". A burst of lightning from the just arrived Taran felled the Olympian. Backlash, charged to capacity, managed to get the trident from the owner.

Watts took Turbo's blow, and used the "speed lightning" coming off of Turbo to target the speedster. Injured, Turbo retreated to recover. Charcoal and the Music Men dropped Shizoku. Inside the tank, Colonel Victory continued to barely stymie the studly ex-President. Backlash smacked Tritan around with his own weapon until the blue-skinned pseudo-god dropped; Backlash then turned the pointed end towards Tritan's head and brought it violently down, and with a loud honking noise, stopped centimeters from his nose. When Watts realized that he was the last man on his team standing and Ampere could counter anything he tried, he surrendered.

Pounding on the rocking tank, informed the occupants the fight was over, and Mahn divested himself of his powers before exiting the tank. As he entered the court building, he extolled the virtues of the Champions, who protected him from his attackers, despite their differences, and then he went to face his day in court. Backlash, proud of his trophy, decided to hand it over to Longbow, the ancient weapon expert.

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Ares » Thu Jul 06, 2017 6:23 pm

The sad thing is that the general concepts behind the Hanna-Barbera Super Friends add ons aren't bad in and of themselves. Its just the presentation that needs some work.

Making Apache Chief into Longshadow showed how you could keep the ethnicity and theme without being too obvious about it.

El Dorado as a South American mystic that specializes in teleportation and illusion works almost as is, just needing a new look and maybe a new name.

Samurai would work better, IMO as a kind of demi-god tied to the Japanese kami Susano, warrior god of the storms. In the old stories, Susano often had to atone for wrongs he committed due to his temper. I could see Samurai being a mortal chosen by Susano to wield some of his power as a hero, to redeem the god, or even as someone who found Susano's sword or gear and gained some of his power. A new look and name is needed fairly badly tho.

The Wonder Twins just need to not be called that, get a looks update and not use their powers like idiots.

There was a toy only hero called Golden Pharaoh, but I'd go a different route by making him an Egyptian scientist who designed some power armor and weapons, making him a high tech hero evoking the older mythology, rather than another magical person from Egypt.

And keep using Black Lightning or Static.

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Goldar » Fri Jul 07, 2017 5:31 pm

Yes, I remember the Golden Pharaoh toy!

Why did they make that?

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Davies » Fri Jul 07, 2017 5:45 pm

Goldar wrote:
Fri Jul 07, 2017 5:31 pm
Yes, I remember the Golden Pharaoh toy!

Why did they make that?
I believe that he was created for the third Super Powers comic book series, the one done by Carmine Infantino, where he appeared as a novice superhero alongside Samurai.

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Goldar » Fri Jul 07, 2017 5:52 pm

Thanks, Davies!

I always thought DC was going to bring him to comics and cartoons.

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Re: Ken's Kache of Khracters (The Superfriends)

Post by Ken » Fri Jul 07, 2017 7:51 pm

If Superfriends/Super Powers had gone another season, he probably would have been used on it. And maybe a few others that were lined up to get toys but never did, like the Atomic Knight.

Heck, even the power-suited Luthor and silver-bodied Brainiac were introduced in 1983 were done because of the toy line.

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