Jab’s Builds! (Silver Surfer! Firelord! Terrax! Nova! Morg!)

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Ares
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Dr. Psycho! Ares! Genocide! The Olympian!)

Post by Ares »

greycrusader wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:22 am The Global Guardians (which initially wasn't even a formal team, just the unofficial title given to a group of foreign heroes who teamed up to aid Superman on a couple occasions) actually had SEVERAL top-tier heroes in terms of powers-the Olympian (demigod level strength and durability, flight, super-speed, various mystic talents such as clairvoyance), Jack O'Lantern (whose magic lamp was near-equal to Alan Scott's), and Seraph (strength of Samson, wisdom of Solomon, courage of Elijah-are you getting a vibe here, Ares?-along with bearing mystic artifacts such as Moses' Staff). But just about NOTHING was ever done with them, because Americans never read comics about superheroes set elsewhere in the world for very long (Alpha Flight and Excalibur are as successful as you're going to get with that).

All my best.
Yeah, one thing I'm trying to avoid for my own setting is it being to "American-centric", so I'm actively trying to have a world-wide superhero population where every major nation has at least one Avengers-style superteam and most of the big ones have a couple of teams and a decent superhero population.
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Ken
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Dr. Psycho! Ares! Genocide! The Olympian!)

Post by Ken »

The Global Guardians, individually, debuted in the Super Friends comic book. They were meant to be the comic book answer to Black Vulcan, Apache Chief, and Samurai from "The All New Super Friends Hour" cartoon.

Then E. Nelson Bridwell, the writer of the Super Friends comic book, wrote an issue of DC Comics Presents which featured the Global Guardians as the team Global Guardians. Bridwell intended the Super Friends to be part of the regular DC "Earth-One" continuity, and regularly referenced things happening in other DC books. No one else at DC felt the same way, and the Super Friends was considered non-canonical. But DC Comics Presents was a different case. So once the Global Guardians appeared there, they were canon.

Of course, DC never really did them justice, either. As stated, the Olympian was potentially in the same class as Superman, Wonder Woman, and Captain Marvel and we can't have that. He debuted in Super Friends.

The classic Argonauts are in a very real sense, the very first super hero team. It was somewhere between 40 and 90 heroes (and heroine) teamed together. And these were heroes known for their individual exploits: Herakles and Iolaus, Theseus, Atalanta, Laërtes, Castor and Pollux being among the better known Greek heroes said to be Argonauts. It was if they just imagined their favorite heroes teaming up.
W: Professor Plum, you were once a professor of psychiatry specializing in helping paranoid and homicidal lunatics suffering from delusions of grandeur.

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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Dr. Psycho! Ares! Genocide! The Olympian!)

Post by Ares »

Ken wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:49 am The classic Argonauts are in a very real sense, the very first super hero team. It was somewhere between 40 and 90 heroes (and heroine) teamed together. And these were heroes known for their individual exploits: Herakles and Iolaus, Theseus, Atalanta, Laërtes, Castor and Pollux being among the better known Greek heroes said to be Argonauts. It was if they just imagined their favorite heroes teaming up.
Agreed, the Argonauts really were the first full on superteam, and one made of established characters from across Greek mythology. You had the leader, the famous powerhouse, the main/only female heroine, the bard, the two guys that could fly, the human-level fighters, the huge roster, it really is the mythological version of the JSA.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Dr. Psycho! Ares! Genocide! The Olympian!)

Post by Ken »

Ares wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:44 am
greycrusader wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:22 am The Global Guardians (which initially wasn't even a formal team, just the unofficial title given to a group of foreign heroes who teamed up to aid Superman on a couple occasions) actually had SEVERAL top-tier heroes in terms of powers-the Olympian (demigod level strength and durability, flight, super-speed, various mystic talents such as clairvoyance), Jack O'Lantern (whose magic lamp was near-equal to Alan Scott's), and Seraph (strength of Samson, wisdom of Solomon, courage of Elijah-are you getting a vibe here, Ares?-along with bearing mystic artifacts such as Moses' Staff). But just about NOTHING was ever done with them, because Americans never read comics about superheroes set elsewhere in the world for very long (Alpha Flight and Excalibur are as successful as you're going to get with that).

All my best.
Yeah, one thing I'm trying to avoid for my own setting is it being to "American-centric", so I'm actively trying to have a world-wide superhero population where every major nation has at least one Avengers-style superteam and most of the big ones have a couple of teams and a decent superhero population.
Creating international teams can be tricky, though. I've tried to do a similar kind of thing where its clear there are parahuman all over the planet. But I also don't ignore that "Super Heroes" are an American concept that's been exported to other places. China, in particular, doesn't have super heroes. It has at least* one costumed non-powered crime-fighter. But in the RCU's China, if one has parahuman powers, one is conscripted into the military. None of this decadent American individualism. If one gets powers, one is required, to use them for the people.

American Rangers (NPC team of American heroes)
Crux Australis (super heroes down under)
Euroforce, the Legion of Super Euros (Europe and Britain's super team)
National Mecha Team of Nippon (the Japanese sentai team with the mecha)
National Solar Parahuman Team of Nippon (the Japanese sentai team with powers)
The Parahuman Society of Canada
la Société Ultrahumaine du Québec (in the RCU Québec seceded from Canada)
The Union of African Supers (less of a team, more of a network)
Federal Security Service of the Russian Federation (Russia's parahumans work for the FSB)
People's Liberation Army Para-Force (China's parahuman branch of the military
The Nations Unies Défense Initiative (or U.N.D.I.) (making the world safe for unelected oligarchs)
W: Professor Plum, you were once a professor of psychiatry specializing in helping paranoid and homicidal lunatics suffering from delusions of grandeur.

PP: Yes, but now I work for the United Nations.

W: So your work has not changed.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Dr. Psycho! Ares! Genocide! The Olympian!)

Post by Ian Turner »

Ares wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 4:06 am Agreed, the Argonauts really were the first full on superteam, and one made of established characters from across Greek mythology. You had the leader, the famous powerhouse, the main/only female heroine, the bard, the two guys that could fly, the human-level fighters, the huge roster, it really is the mythological version of the JSA.
I love how extra they could get. There were Argonauts like Hercules (super-strength), Zetus (flight) and Argus himself (telescopic and X-ray vision), but also completely out there powers like water-walking (Ephialtes?) and bee control (Butes).

Plus at least fifteen different demigods worth of 'generic physical enhancement' and well over a dozen 'really good warriors and swordsmen and kings.'

Olympian should be a beast. :)
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Paper Man

Post by Jabroniville »

Image

PAPER MAN (Horace)
Created By:
Robert Kanigher & Ross Andru
First Appearance: Wonder Woman #165 (Oct. 1966)
Role: One-Off Villain
Group Affiliations: None
PL 8 (123)
STRENGTH
2 STAMINA -- AGILITY 4
FIGHTING 10 DEXTERITY 4
INTELLIGENCE 2 AWARENESS 0 PRESENCE -1

Skills:
Expertise (Paper Company Stuff) 4 (+6)
Perception 4 (+4)
Stealth 4 (+8)

Advantages:
Evasion, Improved Initiative, Ranged Attack 4, Uncanny Dodge

Powers:
"Living Paper"
Immunity 30 (Fortitude Effects) [30]
Protection 4 [4]
"Flat as a Sheet" Insubstantial 1 [5]

"Paper Airplane" Flight 6 (120 mph) (Flaws: Winged) (6) -- [7]
AE: "Rolling Paper Plate" Speed 5 (60 mph) (5)

"Turns Into a Blowpipe For Some Reason" Blast 8 (16) -- [18]
  • AE: "Nasty Papercut" Affliction 8 (Toughness; Dazed & Hindered/Stunned & Immobile) (Extras: Extra Condition) (Flaws: Limited Degree) (8)
  • AE: "Disguise As Paper" Morph 2 (Anything Paper) Linked to Concealment 2 (Vision) (Flaws: Source- Other Paper) (12)
Offense:
Unarmed +10 (+10 Damage, DC 25)
Papercut +10 (+8 Affliction, DC 18)
Blowpipe +8 (+8 Ranged Damage, DC 23)
Initiative +8

Defenses:
Dodge +12 (DC 22), Parry +12 (DC 22), Toughness +4, Fortitude --, Will +4

Complications:
Relationship (Diana Prince)- Diana was the only person who was ever nice to him, and so Horace seeks to win her affections by stealing things for her.
Responsibility (Bullying Victim)- Horace has been picked on his entire life- his co-workers

Total: Abilities: 32 / Skills: 12--6 / Advantages: 7 / Powers: 64 / Defenses: 14 (123)

-Horace worked at a chemical plant that made special paper for military intelligence purposes, and was bullied brutally by his coworkers, who would do "grade school" things like trip him and laugh about his fall. The only person who was ever nice to him was Diana Prince, who visited the plant that day and told off the bullies and helped Horace out. But that same day, he fell into a vat of chemicals designed to make a special kind of paper. This naturally turned him into a flat piece of sentient paper, which of course became a super-villain. He embarked upon a criminal career to steal things for Diana, whom he was now seriously crushing on. He actually does pretty well against Wonder Woman, but dies falling into a printing press.

-Paper Man actually had some very strange, wild powers, including creating a blowpipe that could inexplicably blow holes in concrete dams. He could also turn into a paper airplane or a ball of paper, give papercuts (painful, but not damaging), etc. Honestly he befuddles Wonder Woman for WAY longer than a villain this goofy should have- mostly through evasive tactics, but still.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Dr. Psycho! Ares! Genocide! The Olympian!)

Post by Tattooedman »

greycrusader wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:22 am The Global Guardians (which initially wasn't even a formal team, just the unofficial title given to a group of foreign heroes who teamed up to aid Superman on a couple occasions) actually had SEVERAL top-tier heroes in terms of powers-the Olympian (demigod level strength and durability, flight, super-speed, various mystic talents such as clairvoyance), Jack O'Lantern (whose magic lamp was near-equal to Alan Scott's), and Seraph (strength of Samson, wisdom of Solomon, courage of Elijah-are you getting a vibe here, Ares?-along with bearing mystic artifacts such as Moses' Staff). But just about NOTHING was ever done with them, because Americans never read comics about superheroes set elsewhere in the world for very long (Alpha Flight and Excalibur are as successful as you're going to get with that).

All my best.
You're not wrong, which is sad as I would love to read such a book (assuming the right writer & artist could be assigned said book).
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Tomorrow may not be.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Ares! Genocide! The Olympian! Queen of Fables!)

Post by Tattooedman »

Ares wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:39 am The Queen of Fables is a great Arcade-style "shows up for a fun adventure" villain who exists to create a fun scenario for the heroes to deal with. She'd make a great regular Captain Marvel foe, but is also a great threat for characters who don't deal with magic as much. She could be a solid main event villain with the right push, and could benefit from a team of henchmen with similar fairy tale backgrounds. Maybe some fun jabs at Disney.
Tots agree with you Ares. In fact I shamelessly "borrowed" the concept for my homebrew setting.
We are all tourists, God is our travel agent who has already identified our routes, bookings and destinations... trust him and enjoy life.
Life is just a journey! Therefore, live today!
Tomorrow may not be.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Genocide! Olympian! Queen of Fables! Paper Man!)

Post by KorokoMystia »

Paper Man is a goofy, goofy villain, though outside of his ridiculous appearance, he could be a pretty decent jobber. It's kind of a shame that he was a one-off and killed in his only appearance - his powers are quite versatile (even if they are basically just Mr. Fantastic Lite in ways, like Flatman), at least.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Dr. Psycho! Ares! Genocide! The Olympian!)

Post by drkrash »

Ken wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 4:20 am Creating international teams can be tricky, though. I've tried to do a similar kind of thing where its clear there are parahuman all over the planet. But I also don't ignore that "Super Heroes" are an American concept that's been exported to other places. China, in particular, doesn't have super heroes. It has at least* one costumed non-powered crime-fighter. But in the RCU's China, if one has parahuman powers, one is conscripted into the military. None of this decadent American individualism. If one gets powers, one is required, to use them for the people.

American Rangers (NPC team of American heroes)
Crux Australis (super heroes down under)
Euroforce, the Legion of Super Euros (Europe and Britain's super team)
National Mecha Team of Nippon (the Japanese sentai team with the mecha)
National Solar Parahuman Team of Nippon (the Japanese sentai team with powers)
The Parahuman Society of Canada
la Société Ultrahumaine du Québec (in the RCU Québec seceded from Canada)
The Union of African Supers (less of a team, more of a network)
Federal Security Service of the Russian Federation (Russia's parahumans work for the FSB)
People's Liberation Army Para-Force (China's parahuman branch of the military
The Nations Unies Défense Initiative (or U.N.D.I.) (making the world safe for unelected oligarchs)
I look forward to looking through all of these.
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Re: The Queen of Fables

Post by Spectrum »

Jabroniville wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:34 am THE QUEEN OF FABLES
However, it was a trick- they lock her in a book on the U.S. Tax Code, where nothing imaginative could be found to use as a weapon.


Then she fails to have imagination. Oh the amazing weapons in there, that continue to be put there.
We rise from the ashes so that new legends can be born.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Genocide! Olympian! Queen of Fables! Paper Man!)

Post by Jabroniville »

And with Paper Man, we are DONE with the Wonder Woman set! This was an interesting one, as I was unfamiliar with 90% of the characters. A major issue is a Legion-style “Reboot Syndrome” where everyone simply reinvents the characters rather than use the old stories. This can work (Perez made Ares, Cheetah and Circe legit), but usually just leaves characters feeling impermanent, especially after the second or third revamp. That WW has one of the most hopelessly goofy rogues galleries in both the Golden AND Silver Ages doesn’t help.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Genocide! Olympian! Queen of Fables! Paper Man!)

Post by drkrash »

Huh. The whole series *seemed* shorter than it was. I suppose that's probably a good thing. Both of your last long series have added to my DC reading lists.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Genocide! Olympian! Queen of Fables! Paper Man!)

Post by Ken »

Did I miss your Hercules/Herakles/Harold Campion build?
W: Professor Plum, you were once a professor of psychiatry specializing in helping paranoid and homicidal lunatics suffering from delusions of grandeur.

PP: Yes, but now I work for the United Nations.

W: So your work has not changed.
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Re: Jab’s Builds! (Genocide! Olympian! Queen of Fables! Paper Man!)

Post by Ares »

Jabroniville wrote: Fri Jan 22, 2021 4:17 pm And with Paper Man, we are DONE with the Wonder Woman set! This was an interesting one, as I was unfamiliar with 90% of the characters. A major issue is a Legion-style “Reboot Syndrome” where everyone simply reinvents the characters rather than use the old stories. This can work (Perez made Ares, Cheetah and Circe legit), but usually just leaves characters feeling impermanent, especially after the second or third revamp. That WW has one of the most hopelessly goofy rogues galleries in both the Golden AND Silver Ages doesn’t help.
Yeah, Diana's a great character, but her rogue's gallery needs a major overhaul, and like you said, she suffers from "Reboot" syndrome where everyone wants to change her. I'll have to give my overall thoughts on her soon, before you get started on your next project.
"My heart is as light as a child's, a feeling I'd nearly forgotten. And by helping those in need, I will be able to keep that feeling alive."
- Captain Marvel SHAZAM! : Power of Hope (2000)

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