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[M&M3e] Shrink-Ray, Affliction or Attack Extra?

Posted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:57 pm
by Batgirl III
Image

Trying to make a character with what seems to be a fairly straight-forward power: he can shrink people and objects. He cannot himself shrink, but he zaps you with a beam and presto, you're Tiny.

At first, I built the power thusly:

Shrink-Ray Shrinking 12 (E: Attack, Ranged) [ 36 PP ]

However, when looking over 'Power Profile: Size & Mass' for some inspiration for Alternate Effects and possible Power Stunts, I came across the following:

Shrink-Ray Affliction 12 (Resist: Dodge; Recover: Fortitude; Conditions: Transformed [Shrink to Tiny Size]; E: Progressive, Ranged; F: Limited to Third Degree) [ 24 PP ]

This is a significant reduction in Power Point cost, for a better version of the same Effect! Both of them are by-the-book legal... But I feel a bit guilty about using the Affliction over the Shrinking with Attack Extra build. Shrinking is explictly one of the Power Effects used in the example of how the Attack Extra Modifier works.

What sayeth the Hive-Mind?

Re: [M&M3e] Shrink-Ray, Affliction or Attack Extra?

Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 7:17 am
by Woodclaw
I think I would use the first one, since there's a power purpotedly built for that particular scope I don't see the need to use another. However the key point is that the second contruction is a all-or-nothing effect, if it hits the opponent will be shrunk to a specific size determined by the power, whereas the first gives a certain degree of latitude in handling the transformation.

Re: [M&M3e] Shrink-Ray, Affliction or Attack Extra?

Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 12:25 am
by Ken
I think it depends on the application. If the goal of shrinking people is supposed to make them more useful in a given situation, then the version using Shrinking is more correct. If the goal of shrinking people is to make them easier to manage, capture, etc. then the Affliction is better.

It does occur to me that the Affliction is going to likely be shrugged off by a lot of the Strong'uns, just because of their usually high fortitude scores, but I guess the hope is that the progressive adder will make up for that.

Re: [M&M3e] Shrink-Ray, Affliction or Attack Extra?

Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 1:16 am
by Batgirl III
It’s the massive difference in PP Cost that really irks me.

Re: [M&M3e] Shrink-Ray, Affliction or Attack Extra?

Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 6:43 am
by Jabroniville
TECHNICALLY, the first one also gets a "Cumulative"-ish thing, since you can shrink them further each time. The latter one, while cheaper, just says "turned to shrunk" at the last level, and you have to beat them by a pretty huge amount just to manage THAT. The first one allows you to blast them over and over again, winning by a little each time, I think.

Adding Cumulative to the Affliction evens them out, cost-wise, if that's an issue.

Re: [M&M3e] Shrink-Ray, Affliction or Attack Extra?

Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 4:54 am
by Davies
Batgirl III wrote: Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:57 pm
<snip>

Shrink-Ray Shrinking 12 (E: Attack, Ranged) [ 36 PP ]

<snip>

Shrink-Ray Affliction 12 (Resist: Dodge; Recover: Fortitude; Conditions: Transformed [Shrink to Tiny Size]; E: Progressive, Ranged; F: Limited to Third Degree) [ 24 PP ]
Okay, the target has to make a DC 22 Dodge check to resist the effect. Succeed and nothing happens. Fail at all, and the next round the target has to fail another DC 22 check, and again the next round, before the target becomes shrunk. Fail by 5 or more (DC 17), the process takes one round fewer. Fail by 10 or more (DC 12), the process happens immediately. Any successful save stops the process. For a DC 22 Dodge check, the target has to fail three times in order to become shrunk.

With the other power, it only takes one DC 22 Dodge check for the Shrinking effect to take place.

If anything, I'm not sure you're getting the full value of that Progressive, and you should probably come up with some way that the Shrink Ray leaves the target Impaired or Disabled.